stonechat1
New member
Seems that they both have the same warbler on the front
But the caption is different, and mine, ordered at bookdepository, is a Knopf - version.
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Sibley Guide, 2nd edition (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter jedigrant
- Start date
But the caption is different, and mine, ordered at bookdepository, is a Knopf - version.
lewis20126
Well-known member
Seems that they both have the same warbler on the front
But the caption is different, and mine, ordered at bookdepository, is a Knopf - version.
sorry, a feeble attempt at humour on my part; mine is the Knopf print as well, but I had no idea both editions were so easily available in the uk. Perhaps the other print has a scarlet male Scarlet Tanager?
cheers. a
Richard Klim
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So, can anyone else confirm that the Bloomsbury/Helm imprint has the same 'characteristics'? (I strongly suspect that it does.)
Ruff
Two birds in one.
A couple of comments caught my eye here, ie, if this was the first edition of the Sibley Guide, absolutely everyone would be thrilled with it, and that the almost unremitting negative reviews on Amazon are the result of group- think. Both are true, I believe. I also suspect that the grey print in the new edition is the result of someone's (perhaps the author's?) belief that the bold print used in the first edition ruined the plates' appearance from an artistic point of view, which I guess has gone unappreciated. Prior to the Amazonian pile-on, I was and still am almost perfectly happy with the book. If a second edition improves it, all the better but in my humble opinion, there is only one serious flaw in all the portrayals, and that is in my Amazon review- I've seen this book receive too much battering to repeat it here.
idaho john
Well-known member
and I agree...
I am also a bit offput by all the criticism on the 2nd edition Sibley. I conceed that some of the profiles appear darker and in certain light the text fades a bit, but the overall quality of Mr. Sibley's work is equal to and in fact improved over the original edition. The guide is unworthy of the nasty treatment of the "knowledgeable" crowd.
If he publishes an edition with all the "corrections" that are being clamored for, I am sure that even then, there will be cries for revisions and changes (I am not refering to changes in taxonomy, as he seems most diligent in noting the changes on his website and in his blog on Facebook) and someone will just not be satisfied.
If you find another guide to be superior (including the 1st edition Sibley), please by all means use it and spare the rest of us...
Give it a rest already.
I am also a bit offput by all the criticism on the 2nd edition Sibley. I conceed that some of the profiles appear darker and in certain light the text fades a bit, but the overall quality of Mr. Sibley's work is equal to and in fact improved over the original edition. The guide is unworthy of the nasty treatment of the "knowledgeable" crowd.
If he publishes an edition with all the "corrections" that are being clamored for, I am sure that even then, there will be cries for revisions and changes (I am not refering to changes in taxonomy, as he seems most diligent in noting the changes on his website and in his blog on Facebook) and someone will just not be satisfied.
If you find another guide to be superior (including the 1st edition Sibley), please by all means use it and spare the rest of us...
Give it a rest already.
I'm pleased with it. In fact I think it is easier to use and I like it better than the 1st edition.
But then I don't read reviews of guide books. I find all of them helpful. Some are easier to use than others. And there is far more in any of them than I will ever learn.
Bob
But then I don't read reviews of guide books. I find all of them helpful. Some are easier to use than others. And there is far more in any of them than I will ever learn.
Bob
I think the entire discussion was prefaced with a note saying that we realize that the new edition is generally an improvement of the first edition, and as such, very good indeed. Regarding the pale grey text, it seems that I am more negatively affected by this than most people -- and I still hate it!
Niels
Niels
Richard Klim
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It's unfortunate that publication of the the second edition of the best field guide to North American birds has been clouded by concerns over aspects of the printing. But despite David Sibley's statement in January that he's very pleased with the colour reproduction, it seems clear that the light text font in particular is a genuine problem for many (especially older) birders, and has been acknowledged by Knopf with the recent confirmation of type and colour adjustments in the next printing.
But I see this as reasonable and valid criticism, not "nasty" treatment! Field guides are frequently consulted in low-light conditions (dawn/dusk, under forest canopy, in vehicles, hides, tents, poorly-lit accommodation, by torchlight...), and readability is surely more important than aesthetics.
A great example of immediate customer feedback stimulating worthwhile product improvement...
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idaho john
Well-known member
and...
Richard: thanks for your response.
It is sad to me that the term - reasonable and valid criticism in this case - has become the new politically correct term for what seems like character assassination. Read the reviews on Amazon and on other forums.
The Sibley guide is a monumental work of achievement and scholarship, but instead of acknowledging this, it appears that "faint grey text and too dark profiles" will be his legacy. Via acclamation by positive and supportive junior scientists everywhere.
I hope the "next edition" of the Sibley Guide to Birds, will feature the changes so earnestly advocated for. I pray I won't expire from dyspepsia brought on by - "faint grey text and too dark profiles" before its arrival.
Richard: thanks for your response.
It is sad to me that the term - reasonable and valid criticism in this case - has become the new politically correct term for what seems like character assassination. Read the reviews on Amazon and on other forums.
The Sibley guide is a monumental work of achievement and scholarship, but instead of acknowledging this, it appears that "faint grey text and too dark profiles" will be his legacy. Via acclamation by positive and supportive junior scientists everywhere.
I hope the "next edition" of the Sibley Guide to Birds, will feature the changes so earnestly advocated for. I pray I won't expire from dyspepsia brought on by - "faint grey text and too dark profiles" before its arrival.
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Monumental work of "scholarship"? C'mon, rein it in a little, it's a field guide and a very good one, in my view the best available for North America. But it has flaws, the gray text being a particularly serious one to my old eyes, and is thus the legitimate target of criticism which in the thread so far has been measured and entirely appropriate IMO.
People say all kinds of silly and intemperate things on Amazon. Nothing to get upset about. You just need to pick and choose what to read.
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stonechat1
New member
I doubt that David Sibley and Knopf would agree on the complains and plan a quick 2nd print if there wouldn´t be reason for that. Some people are having problems with the grey colour of the text and others with the colour of some paintings. Reason enough for them to do a 2nd print. I don´t see anything wrong with this, right contrary.
IMO, it shows that Sibley and Knopf are taking the issues of their customers serious and this is a good thing.
IMO, it shows that Sibley and Knopf are taking the issues of their customers serious and this is a good thing.
Richard Klim
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I can't claim to have read every review on Amazon and other forums, but I don't recall reading anything that could be described as "character assassination". As far as I can see, any critical comments have concerned the book, not the author's character.
As fugl notes, reviews on Amazon can sometimes be rather exaggerated or dismissive, but that's commonplace in all types of online customer reviews nowadays. Nevertheless, most of the reviews of the second edition award 5 or 4 stars.
Richard Klim
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Birding / aba blog
Jen Brumfield, aba blog, 21 May 2014: The New Sibley.
Brumfield 2014. The New Sibley [a review of The Sibley Guide to Birds of North America, Second Edition, by David Allen Sibley]. Birding 46(3): 65.
Jen Brumfield, aba blog, 21 May 2014: The New Sibley.
Brumfield 2014. The New Sibley [a review of The Sibley Guide to Birds of North America, Second Edition, by David Allen Sibley]. Birding 46(3): 65.
Ruff
Two birds in one.
Quite agree with Fugi. THAT'S a review that comes closer to the mark than most.
stonechat1
New member
And I never such a introduction (totaly unessential and two sides on my monitor !) before the real/intrinsic review.Wow, now there's a review! I've never seen so many adjectives in my life!
dacol
Well-known member
What a useless review, and she complains that she has only 1500 words to use.
Dalcio
Richard Klim
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