Yesterday near Eindhoven Netherlands - female Black Redstart? (1 Viewer)

[Bertus]

March 23rd around noon, farmland with fens, on a walk with guide. Somebody mentioned the name, I would not have thought about a Black Redstart, the female does not have the clear distinctives as the male. Is that correct? The last pic shows the distance at 900mm. Tnx for help

 

[Southern Frogmouth]

Definitely a Black Redstart.

 

[Alexander Stöhr]

Hello Bertus,

yes, I agree with Southern Frogmouth, its a Black Redstart.

Please note, that confident sexing of such "female-type" birds is extremly difficult. Some 2cy males also have an identical plumage and the worn state of the flight feathers now doesnt help. Even birds with very whitish panel in the wings, ghosting a male-pattern should normally better left unsexed and aged in the field.

See:

View of Sexing and aging of Black Redstarts Phoenicurus ochruros

'Paradoxus' Black Redstart

I remember when I caught my first Black Redstart (Phoenicurus ochruros) and I read, in Svensson's: " 1Y male (two morphs; one rare, ' pa...

birdingmarc.blogspot.com

http://blascozumeta.com/specie_files/11210_ENG_Phoenicurus_ochruros_aranzadi.pdf

https://ringersdigiguide.ottenby.se/species/phoenicurus-ochruros/sexing/

Limicola: Downloads (Plumages, measurements and age criteria of Black Redstart Phoenicurus ochruros from Bernd Nicolai, Christopher Schmidt, Frank-Ulrich Schmidt and Christopher Schmidt)

Redstart, West Cork, Ireland

My first impression seeing this bird yesterday was Common Redstart, but on reviewing the photos I took, I’m thinking more towards Black. The amount of white in the wing seems unusual either way. I’d be grateful for others’ opinions.

www.birdforum.net

Thanks from me to Grahame Walbridge again, very helpful!

 

[TheBlackGrouse]

Any buildings there? Black Redstarts in the Netherlands use old sheds, stables, things like that. They are almost always within 100 meter of a building.

[To UK readers: we don't have stone walls around our meadows, rocks are extremely rare over here. For instance, Wheatears use rabbit holes]

Common Redstarts are found in open forests, heathland with birch, often near fens. For breeding they use old nests of woodpeckers or natural holes in the trees.

Both are locally common species in Brabant, the Netherlands.

 

[Xenospiza]

Any buildings there? Black Redstarts in the Netherlands use old sheds, stables, things like that. They are almost always within 100 meter of a building.

[To UK readers: we don't have stone walls around our meadows, rocks are extremely rare over here. For instance, Wheatears use rabbit holes]

Common Redstarts are found in open forests, heathland with birch, often near fens. For breeding they use old nests of woodpeckers or natural holes in the trees.

Both are locally common species in Brabant, the Netherlands.

During migration (= now!), Black Redstarts can be found in odd places more associated with Common Redstart.

The photo fits how expect to see them on my local patch.

 

[Southern Frogmouth]

During migration (= now!), Black Redstarts can be found in odd places more associated with Common Redstart.

The photo fits how expect to see them on my local patch.

Agreed. On passage I have seen Black Redstarts in places miles away from buildings in habitats you wouldn't normally associate with them in the breeding season - I always check dung heaps for Black Redstarts on migration periods as well as more typical areas. Similarly Common Redstarts are also seen in habitats nothing like those they would breed in when migrating.

 

[TheBlackGrouse]

Maybe in other countries but not really in Brabant, a densely populated provence in the Netherlands.

There, Black Redstarts always find something that resembles their original habitat. For instance, in 30 years of birding there I never saw one in a forest.

Besides, this is the northern part of their breeding range. Not many migrants here. In general, what we see is what we get as breeding birds.

For Common Redstart it's a different story, they even breed in the northern parts of Scandinavia.

You have a point though, I forgot to mention that you have to take into account the behavior of the bird. Migrants behave differently than breeding birds.

 

[Bertus]

Tnx for all reactions. To be more clear: there was a one large farmhouse quite near, but only one plus lots of nature. But I read that during migration the Black Redstart can be found everywhere as was mentioned here. And that they return about half March. Very few stay here in the winter. On the other hand I remember I was surprised when my brother showed me a nesting Common Redstart in his garden, in a birdhouse on the wall of his shed. I have to look up the pictures of that, few years ago, to put here and check again. Usually I found them in open land etc. as The BlackGrouse described. Interesting matter, to be continued....

 

[TheBlackGrouse]

Everything is possible, try to focus on behavior in such a case. For instance, did it stay close to that farmhouse or did it fly into the forest?

A migrating Wheatear is just standing somewhere. Even on heathland you can see that this part is not suitable for breeding. When disturbed it simply flies away. Potential breeding birds have a 'connection' with the site. A male Wheatear on the top of a small dune, not moving for 10 minutes, checking the environment, is an indicator for a breeding pair.

Things like that, it makes birding much more interesting