Village or Black-headed Weaver in Portugal? (2 Viewers)

[John Cantelo]

Some sources (e.g. http://www.britishbirds.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/article_files/V90/V90_N12/V90_N12_P562_568_A142.pdf & Lever's "Naturalised birds of the World" suggest that Village Weaver Ploceus cucullatus (confusingly sometimes also called Black-headed Weaver!) has a large & growing population in Portugal. However, the Collins Guide & de Juana & Garcia (The Birds of the Iberian Peninsula) maintain that it's the 'other' Black-headed Weaver Ploceus melanocephalus. Presumably this population has been re-identified as P. melanocephalus - can anyone confirm this and, if possible, direct me to a source for this re-identification?

 

[Jon Turner]

No I can't, but I thought that the Weavers I saw near Faro Airport building a nest many many moons ago were Black-headed.

 

[Ernest Garcia]

Both species have been identified in Portugal but only P. melanocephalus seems to have self-sustaining populations; in the Lisbon area, Caldas da Rainha, the Tagus valley and Algarve. It is in Category C. P. cucullatus was recorded breeding in the 1990s but not recently. Some records of the latter may have been misidentifications of the former but it seems that both have nested at one time or other. More details are available in the 2008 Portuguese Atlas (Equipa Atlas, Atlas das aves nidificantes em Portugal (1999–2005) and in Aves de Portugal, Catry et al. 2010.

 

[John Cantelo]

Both species have been identified in Portugal but only P. melanocephalus seems to have self-sustaining populations; in the Lisbon area, Caldas da Rainha, the Tagus valley and Algarve. It is in Category C. P. cucullatus was recorded breeding in the 1990s but not recently. Some records of the latter may have been misidentifications of the former but it seems that both have nested at one time or other. More details are available in the 2008 Portuguese Atlas (Equipa Atlas, Atlas das aves nidificantes em Portugal (1999–2005) and in Aves de Portugal, Catry et al. 2010.

Many thanks Ernest. I'd forgotten about the Portuguese Atlas - another one to add to my 'wanted' list!

 

[Pedro Ramalho]

The species currently in Portugal, is Black-headed Weaver (Ploceus melanocephalus) there were some Village Weaver in the 90’s but they never became established.
Black-headed weaver occurs in 4 different areas, but the population in Paul da Tornada and the population in the Tajo estuary seems to be declining.
You can check current distribution on eBird, just change the data interval:

http://ebird.org/ebird/map/blhwea1?...30.03&env.maxX=-6.189&env.maxY=42.154&gp=true

 

[John Cantelo]

The species currently in Portugal, is Black-headed Weaver (Ploceus melanocephalus) there were some Village Weaver in the 90’s but they never became established.
Black-headed weaver occurs in 4 different areas, but the population in Paul da Tornada and the population in the Tajo estuary seems to be declining.
You can check current distribution on eBird, just change the data interval:

http://ebird.org/ebird/map/blhwea1?...30.03&env.maxX=-6.189&env.maxY=42.154&gp=true

Thanks. Interesting that some populations are declining in Portugal given that they seem to be expanding in Spain. Has the habitat changed or might this reflect a narrow genetic heritage?

 

[Pedro Ramalho]

Probably a combination of factors, illegal trapping, small size of the founding population, and competition with other exotics species like yellow-crowned bishop (Euplectes afer) that are much more abundant and expansive. By contrast Black-headed weaver seems to have difficult do colonize suitable habitat even if it’s near the current areas.

 

[Simon Wates]

Probably a combination of factors, illegal trapping, small size of the founding population, and competition with other exotics species like yellow-crowned bishop (Euplectes afer) that are much more abundant and expansive. By contrast Black-headed weaver seems to have difficult do colonize suitable habitat even if it’s near the current areas.

Agreed and probably more factors. Its worth bearing in mind that contrary to the large numbers in the Lisbon area, in the Algarve, Yellow-crowned Bishop is at much fewer sites and in less numbers than Black-headed Weaver- Furthermore the YC Bishops that I know down here move away from there autumn breeding sites.

As an aside, but I thought John and others may be quite interested; the presence of Pin-tailed Whydah in Portugal (Aveiro area?) - there doesn't seem to be much information except photos on the net and by those it seems they are breeding a few years now (presumably parasiting Common Waxbill?). See photos here:

https://www.flickr.com/search/?group_id=26922203%40N00&view_all=1&text=Vidua%20macroura

Are these the only ones in the WP?

 

[Gonçalo Elias]

the presence of Pin-tailed Whydah in Portugal (Aveiro area?) - there doesn't seem to be much information except photos on the net

Hi Simon, there is a reasonable number of sightings in eBird, check this out:

http://ebird.org/ebird/portugal/map...mr=1-12&bmo=1&emo=12&yr=all&byr=1900&eyr=2016

(you need to zoom in)

 

[John Cantelo]

Agreed and probably more factors. Its worth bearing in mind that contrary to the large numbers in the Lisbon area, in the Algarve, Yellow-crowned Bishop is at much fewer sites and in less numbers than Black-headed Weaver- Furthermore the YC Bishops that I know down here move away from there autumn breeding sites.

As an aside, but I thought John and others may be quite interested; the presence of Pin-tailed Whydah in Portugal (Aveiro area?) - there doesn't seem to be much information except photos on the net and by those it seems they are breeding a few years now (presumably parasiting Common Waxbill?). See photos here:

https://www.flickr.com/search/?group_id=26922203%40N00&view_all=1&text=Vidua%20macroura

Are these the only ones in the WP?

Thanks, Simon - most interesting. Perhaps, there ought to be a thread devoted to exotic species in Europe .... Interesting too to look at e-bird records. Exactly why are there quite so many feral ex-cage birds in Portugal?

 

[Simon Wates]

Hi Simon, there is a reasonable number of sightings in eBird, check this out:

http://ebird.org/ebird/portugal/map...mr=1-12&bmo=1&emo=12&yr=all&byr=1900&eyr=2016

(you need to zoom in)

Thanks, Simon - most interesting. Perhaps, there ought to be a thread devoted to exotic species in Europe .... Interesting too to look at e-bird records. Exactly why are there quite so many feral ex-cage birds in Portugal?

I'm surprised that Pin-tailed Whydah in Portugal doesn't seem to be on some keen WP lister's radar - after all quite few traveling folk go looking for a number of other exotics here. I have never been for them as they are far north for me but I get the impression that they wouldn't be too difficult?

 

[Pedro Ramalho]

I'm surprised that Pin-tailed Whydah in Portugal doesn't seem to be on some keen WP lister's radar - after all quite few traveling folk go looking for a number of other exotics here. I have never been for them as they are far north for me but I get the impression that they wouldn't be too difficult?

They’re not countable, not on C category.

 

[Simon Wates]

They’re not countable, not on C category.

Yes, of course but they must be meeting the requirements! How many years does a breeding population have to exist before inclusion?

 

[Pedro Ramalho]

Yes, of course but they must be meeting the requirements! How many years does a breeding population have to exist before inclusion?

There numbers are very low Simon, the populations are small and very fragmented, other species like Scaly-breasted munia (Lonchura punctulata) and blue-crowned parakeet (Thectocercus acuticaudatus) are more probable to be included in C category in Portugal. But after the collapse and disappearance of the chestnut munia (Lonchura atricapilla) the promotion of another species to C category is going to take some time.

 

[Simon Wates]

Thanks Pedro, it seems that Portugal has more exotics than Spain (?) - if so I wonder why. In my years in Spain I'd see more cagebirds than here in Portugal - though it was a long time ago.

As an aside, on at least 2 or 3 occasions "Black-headed Bunting" has been seen in the Quinta do Lago and Vilamoura areas. Not surprising I suppose as the males don't really look like anything else in most field guides.