One for the Gull experts (1 Viewer)

[Tony Morris]

My son,Rob, and I found this interesting Gull at Marina del Rey, just a spit away from LAX airport on 12/4/2013. It was with Western, Ring-billed and California Gulls. "White-winged" gulls are a challenge on the West Coast of N America, the opinion of any Gull experts out there is welcome.
the pictures are here:

http://stmargaretsphotodiary.blogspot.co.uk/2013/05/one-for-larophiles.html

many thanks.
Tony

 

[Tony Morris]

Hi "J Moore"
I haven't said what's in my notebook, I'd like to see what others think without prejudice.
Tony

 

[KenM]

Tony Hi,

I'm thinking that it's not a particularly 'large gull,' and am assuming that it's more in the range of Thayer's x Iceland Gull for size?

Noting the tail-band and secondary barring...I'll suggest a hybrid of the above?

cheers

 

[Tony Morris]

Ken. I did say Gull experts!

 

[lou salomon]

it has some similarity with this bleached thayer's: http://www.pbase.com/jpkln/image/133779896 and jizz of the bird is very thayer's, but i fear pale tongues in outer primaries are too restriced to belong to a thayeri. the only other contender i see is a small female smithsonianus. any case it's not a white winger (glaucoides/kumlieni/hyperboreus)

 

[Tony Morris]

Thanks Lou, I was using the term "white wing" to include Thayer's, it seems wrongly. we discussed this bird with a lot of American birders on a pelagic the next day in San Diego, they felt it was probably a Thayer's. The bird appears to me to still be in juvenile plumage. Rather bleached, and as such the primaries pretty well match those shown in Olsen and Larsson, photo 290. I haven't seen many smithsonianus in this plumage, but I can't find any photos quite as pale. There certainly seems to be a similarity between our bird and the one you flagged up.
cheers,
Tony

 

[KenM]

Ken. I did say Gull experts!

Apologies Tony, I missed the thread title...I would certainly never aspire to being an expert..as a fall from grace could be quite painful! Thus I prefer to troll at a much lower level. There will always be a large learner plate on my back, that way I enjoy 'the upward learning curve'...I'll give you a wave If I see you! where should I look for you...above or below?

 

[Tony Morris]

Hi Ken,
In the Gulls area I guess on about the same rung, they're difficult b*ggers aren't they. I should have put a smiley on my last post, just my mischievous sense of humour,
cheers
Tony

 

[lou salomon]

i have little experience with thayer's gull, but structurally (shortish legs, longish wings and weak bill reminding somewhat of a real white-winger) it looks very thayeri-like, as i said. the pale tongues might be hidden in the 3rd pic, visible in the 4th and inner primary pattern very pale - but i guess probably overlapping in variation with some pale american herring gulls. such bleached ind. in spring certainly are a real challenge...peter adriaens or maybe an american gull afficionado might get further with this. good luck.

 

[Tony Morris]

Thanks Lou, your comments are very helpful. I guess Thayer's is never easy away from breeding grounds.
Tony