New AX Visio 10x32 binocular (4 Viewers)

[tehri]

it's about not wanting to wear a brick around my neck all day. Maybe if I was going out for 20-30min to take my dog for a stroll, it wouldn't matter. The problem is I don't HAVE a dog ;-)

You should !! ahaha !

 

[james holdsworth]

I’ve never thought of weight on my neck as a physical strain, just a major annoyance. So, of course, less is better. I think Swarovski should be congratulated on taking this step, but I’ll be waiting for more advanced iterations that get closer to what I’m after.

 

[etudiant]

It's scope creep but it's relevant to the AX: Weight DOES matter to some of us. I keep in pretty good shape and have done some respectable hiking, backpacking, trekking etc., including independent (carrying my own kit) walks in Himalayas to almost 19,000'. In past I was also a climber, often humping camping gear, rope, rack, food, water, to get to base of peak. None of this is to brag - simply to say that as I age, more and more, reducing weight around my neck in particular, and on my back/knees in general, IS a priority. Most of my birding is at least 2-3mi, and I often carry lunch, water, camera with big zoom, and sometimes small scope and requisite tripod. If very scenic, maybe a wide-angle lens too. When traveling i typically take all my stuff 'carry-on' and all my optic/birding/essentials in a dedicated daypack.

It's not about being in shape or not - it's about not wanting to wear a brick around my neck all day. Maybe if I was going out for 20-30min to take my dog for a stroll, it wouldn't matter. The problem is I don't HAVE a dog ;-)

It would also not matter if I was taking a cruise maybe? Except I've never done, and don't plan to do, a cruise. I'd own a dog first

Honestly, if you're willing to carry a scope, a tripod, a camera with a long lens plus lunch and water, does the extra pound this weighs versus a conventional glass really make a difference? You could even use it to replace your camera, you'd probably get more pictures because it's so easy and save weight besides.
PS If you just put it on a bandoleer, your neck will thank you.

 

[Hermann]

I am prepared to carry a reasonably heavy binocular if it offers some significant advantages over lighter binoculars. My Canon 10x42 is even heavier than the Visio but with a harness the weight doesn't bother me too much, not even when I carry a scope+tripod, a camera and my foul weather gear+food+water. Others prefer a much lighter setup. That's fine, everybody is different.

The more interesting question is how significant the advantages of the Visio are, in other words: Is it worth getting the Visio to replace other binoculars? The answer to this question will depend on your personal preferences, as always.

I myself won't get the Visio for a number of reasons:

1. The Visio doesn't have image stabilisation. That's a no-go as far as I'm concerned, especially considering the weight and the price. (And in case you believe a 10x32 doesn't need stabilisation because you've got "steady hands": You're mistaken. Period. Check Holger Merlitz' book, there's a nice summary on p. 149-150.) There is also no tripod bush, and the shape of the binocular makes it difficult to attach to a tripod or monopod.

2. The camera is from what I can see at best sufficient for mediocre ID shots - if the bird is close enough. A tiny sensor (scale factor to 35mm is 7.5!), short focal length (35mm equivalent is 260mm), no image stabilisation. None of the photos I've seen is convincing (even though they were all taken in reasonable light at low ISO) with a distinct lack of detail and visible image noise. There is also no microphone for video.

3. The Merlin App in it's present form is only suitable for "easy", i.e. distinct species. From what I've seen it definitely won't be able to identify "difficult species" with any degree of certainty. Warblers and other LBJs - no way. And the birds need to be quite close because of the short focal length of the camera.

I personally think there may be some people with a high disposable income who might get a pair, simply because it's a nice toy, possibly also some people who travel a lot.

I also believe Swarovski made a big mistake by not going for a binocular with image stabilisation first.

Hermann

 

[pppppvvvv]

I wouldn't be happy buying this unless the software behind it was confidently and consistently identifying races.
Otherwise the whole product risks becoming obsolete if there is an appetite for splitting, months or years down the line.

Plus many other reasons mentioned by others

AND, it's just not how I enjoy my hobby. The finding and identifying is all that motivates me really.

 

[pppppvvvv]

I wouldn't be happy buying this unless the software behind it was confidently and consistently identifying races.
Otherwise the whole product risks becoming obsolete if there is an appetite for splitting, months or years down the line.

Plus many other reasons mentioned by others

AND, it's just not how I enjoy my hobby. The finding and identifying is all that motivates me really.

And perhaps something more sinister, paranoid and far-fetched to consider: if future taxonomic decisions were biased or influenced towards not having the software and expensive products become less useful haha.

 

[etudiant]

I wouldn't be happy buying this unless the software behind it was confidently and consistently identifying races.
Otherwise the whole product risks becoming obsolete if there is an appetite for splitting, months or years down the line.

Plus many other reasons mentioned by others

AND, it's just not how I enjoy my hobby. The finding and identifying is all that motivates me really.

Presumably the software used can be readily updated. The glass has wireless connectivity after all.
So expect the performance to get better over time, as Merlin improves..

 

[pppppvvvv]

Presumably the software used can be readily updated. The glass has wireless connectivity after all.
So expect the performance to get better over time, as Merlin improves..

I suspect it has reached its limit, and the likes of Sykes Warbler for example, that would have a typical UK birder scratching his head, would also have this binocular scratching its camera module?

But I may be wrong, would love to see what it makes of rarer warblers in the field. Etc

 

[jgraider]

I'm betting on an epic fail regarding this product.

 

[etudiant]

I suspect it has reached its limit, and the likes of Sykes Warbler for example, that would have a typical UK birder scratching his head, would also have this binocular scratching its camera module?

But I may be wrong, would love to see what it makes of rarer warblers in the field. Etc

I doubt that even the more refined versions of Merlin would be able to reliably tell tough IDs.
Photo IDs are often uncertain even for experts here on BF,. It seems unlikely that even an excellent AI can provide confidently correct answers in more difficult cases. Gulls for instance seem a minefield for ID based on a few photos.

 

[pppppvvvv]

I doubt that even the more refined versions of Merlin would be able to reliably tell tough IDs.
Photo IDs are often uncertain even for experts here on BF,. It seems unlikely that even an excellent AI can provide confidently correct answers in more difficult cases. Gulls for instance seem a minefield for ID based on a few photos.

Hmm, it's a pity. Just when it starts getting useful it gives up.

I mentioned it up thread, but I think the Merlin sound element coupled to a good recording system would have more potential.
It's rare that I see something I can't identify in Europe, but I'm always hearing weird calls, or my "80s post-punk concert battered" hearing misses the calls completely.

A steer, even if less than 100% accurate at this time as mentioned by Canip, would be useful

 

[dalat]

I guess tools like Merlin will always face similar limits as human birders, when it comes to bad views and crappy record shots. Perhaps for LBJs, AI will have some advantages, as it may potentially be better in dealing with measurements such as primary projection than (most) humans.

Anyway, even if AI does not get better than experienced birders (I really hope it does not) it can still be fun and useful to novice birders or experienced birders in new regions as a tool to help learning.

 

[Maljunulo]

LBJs?

 

[Nethero]

LBJs?

 

[Canip]

I'm betting on an epic fail regarding this product.

How much do you bet ?

 

[dalat]

Not sure if the Visio will be a commercial success, but I think it is a good move by Swarovski in any case. Classical binocular development has pretty much peaked and as a minimum, Swaro has now shown that they are not content with adding useless strap attachments to their expensive binoculars but that they are actually leading innovation.

 

[Jon.Bryant]

I guess tools like Merlin will always face similar limits as human birders, when it comes to bad views and crappy record shots. Perhaps

I am probably repeating what has been said earlier, but the more challenging IDs are often resolved through prolonged observation, not a few photos - specific plumage features, vocalisations, moult timing, structure, behaviour and even flight action can all provide clues for certain difficult identifications. Even when photos can clinch an ID it is often specific details that need to be captured - under tail coverts, outer tail feathers, primary emargination and the like!

… but the majority of species identifications don’t fall into the difficult camp. How often do reasonably competent birders need to ‘work on an ID’? I don’t think it is often at all. Or perhaps I am glossing over say Marsh Warblers as Reed Warblers without even knowing it, or being the slightest bit suspicious - I hope not!

This is where I don’t quite understand the concept of the binoculars. Most of the time I wouldn’t be pressing the button to capture an image for analysis - most of the time I am reasonably confident with my identifications. Surely there would be some ‘delay’ in your birdwatching, if you were constantly capturing images and sending everything for analysis anyway? This isn’t a system like a fighter pilots visor - you can’t pan across a lake and have real time ID flash on the screen to make sure you don’t skip over that sleeping Ferruginous Duck. But then, the problem for me is that on the occasions I do want ‘help’ and press the button, Merlin will probably not be up to the challenge - and quite possibly for really challenging IDs a photo based analysis programme never will be!

This surely means that we have a very expensive binocular targetting novices or birdwatchers who do not feel confident with their ID skills - there is nothing wrong with starting out or not being good at ID (it is only a hobby after all), but who spends $5k as a novice or on a hobby they are not that serious about. Are the binoculars doomed to become a plaything of the rich, mildly enthusiastic birdwatcher?

 

[Mono]

All the reviews from those who went to the pre-launch press days emphasise the Visio's use by experienced birders who have travelled someone outside their usual realm. Whilst this might be a valid use case, I do struggle with someone spending $5K on holiday only binoculars.

 

[Jon.Bryant]

Classical binocular development has pretty much peaked

This is probably true… I prefer to think of good binoculars as well engineered pieces of craftmanship, which should last the user a very long time…. I have had two main pairs or binoculars in 35 years!

Rather than saying binocular technology has plateaued, I would argue that some designs are timeless and that good binoculars do a fantastic job of doing what they are designed for.

 

[dalat]

All the reviews from those who went to the pre-launch press days emphasise the Visio's use by experienced birders who have travelled someone outside their usual realm. Whilst this might be a valid use case, I do struggle with someone spending $5K on holiday only binoculars

Just look how many birders you see with the latest Swaro NL or similar around the neck. For most of those its not the first >2k binocular, but the second or third. Or look at some of the threads here with people showing their lineup. Plenty of people have spent much more than 5k on binoculars they don't really need.

So why not having a Visio for foreign travels and for trips when you want to take record shots, and a classical binocular for birding the local patch?

While its too expensive for me, I can see the appeal.