Conquest where made? (1 Viewer)

[lmans66]

I have heard that the Conquest brand is not many in Germany....the Victory brand is though. Am I right?

 

[Dennis Mau]

Both the Zeiss Conquest and the Victory are made in Germany.

 

[Steve C]

When the Conquest first came out they were from a contract between Zeiss and Kamakura in Japan. There was an argument with Jan VanDalen and Zeiss. Jan told customers where they were made and Zeiss objected. For a time, Jan removed Zeiss products from his store...IF I remember correctly. Maybe Jan can chime in here. There was a substantial portion of a big thread concerning this here on BF.

Unless changed quite recently, the laws of the EU only required 10% of the work to be done in a particular country for the label to say...for example, Made In Germany.

BF members from the EU may be able to shed light on this. Right now think the Conquest is largely Japanese. If this is different, I'd like to know. I know the box says "Made in Germany". Maybe the box is.

 

[lmans66]

AH!...Sounds so political and like what is here in America!!!!... If 10% made in Germany, is it made in Germany? Only by some legislation and not reality!...Anyhow, I heard when I bought my HT's 6-7 years ago that the HT's were from Germany and the Conquest was from Japan. Nothing wrong with Japan to be honest (not china)...but interesting on the politics.

 

[dries1]

"I know the box says "Made in Germany". Maybe the box is".

This made me chuckle, one never knows these days though.

Andy W.

 

[CharleyBird]

'Made in Germany' for me means partly assembled and then finished off in Germany; hopefully with German skill aquired and passed on over many years, and with some meaningful quality control.

 

[42za]

Hello All,

To me , "Made in Germany" should mean just that.
If any parts , sub-assemblies , glass etc. are outsourced from another country outside Germany then the product in my mind does not qualify for the label "Made in Germany" , rather they should use the label "Assembled in Germany".

I do realise that the modern world thinks contrary to me.

Off-topic , How does Swarovski stack up.

Cheers.

 

[PYRTLE]

Off-topic , How does Swarovski stack up.

I'm certain that I recall some of the items found within a box containing an EL, as well as other components are outsourced or manufactured outside of Austria. Perhaps the objective covers, rainguard, strap and even the rubber armouring. These are then assembled / packed in the Tirrol factory.

 

[Mark9473]

I wish you guys would make it clear if you're talking about the Conquest or the Conquest HD.

 

[jan van daalen]

The current Conquest is completely Made in Japan/made ready for use in Germany, so by EU Law companies are allowed to sell it as Made in Germany.
A few years ago it was a hot item for some within Zeiss but anno 2020 it is not anymore.
For me, as a optics purist, it's a shame that brands like Zeiss and Leica outsources to the Far East. Zeiss wanted to get a finger in the market of middle grade (Terra) and higher middle grade (Conquest) and had to outsource for financial reasons. Still Made in Germany sells better then Made in Japan.......

The first generation Conquests were made in the Zeiss factory in Hungary.

Jan

 

[Ian Byrnes]

The current Conquest is completely Made in Japan/made ready for use in Germany, so by EU Law companies are allowed to sell it as Made in Germany.
A few years ago it was a hot item for some within Zeiss but anno 2020 it is not anymore.
For me, as a optics purist, it's a shame that brands like Zeiss and Leica outsources to the Far East. Zeiss wanted to get a finger in the market of middle grade (Terra) and higher middle grade (Conquest) and had to outsource for financial reasons. Still Made in Germany sells better then Made in Japan.......

The first generation Conquests were made in the Zeiss factory in Hungary.

Jan

Jan surely this doesn't compromise the quality?

 

[slingworks]

Being made in Japan isn't a compromise these days...Most things are built to specifications laid out by the purchaser anyway.....

Made in Germany doesn't mean much more than assembled in Germany, often from fully completed sub assemblies.

I once purchased a piece of machinery "Made in Italy" Later on, when needing to service it I looked it over more in depth..Nothing inside said made in Italy...Most components were labeled China. Even the large 2000lb cast iron housing appeared of Chinese origin....I guess "Made in Germany is about the same thing.

Doesn't Zeiss buy allot of it's lenses from Asia anyway? Nikkor Philippines, etc..Probably S.Korea, Japan and China as well I'd imagine. Not really very many grind glass...I bet those new victories everyone loves sport quite a bit of Japanese glass!

At least "Made in USA" has a little more weight than made in "Germany." For government contracts I seem to remember it being a requirement of 51% of major component value had to be USA made. The FTC says "Made in USA" means with no, or negligible foreign components. It's why Leupold can't use the Made in USA label any longer on it's optics....

 

[Steve C]

I tend to think Zeiss is well aware of the positive perception of a well known, widely recognized company. While they may well be coy about source origin in the Conquest HD, they very well would not have gone down the Japanese source trail if they were not confident Kamakura was up to doing what Zeiss wanted done.

Once at a show, a Swarovski rep told me that Swarovski gets their glass from Schott, O'Hara, and Hoya. The last two are Japanese. However all global companies have factories stuttered all over the globe, so some Schott glass may come from China, and some Hoya may come from elsewhere than Japan. I have read that Hoya is the primary source for the base silicone sand used in initial optical glass formation.

 

[lmans66]

My understanding was that the alpha model (Victory's) were always intended to be made in their European factories while the Conquest (of any variety) were Japan and the Terras? Well...not sure on the latter.

I would hope that quality control would hold true regardless but I doubt it. My thinking.
Thus,...when I look at Alpha binoculars, I know they are made with quality and go out the door with a thorough inspection (each and every one of them). The further down the line you go, you take your chances.

Not sure how this compares to other companies such as Swaro so can't respond to that. But I am guessing that some brands (Vortex etc) ...lack quality control big time.

 

[Ian Byrnes]

I was lead to believe that the Conquest HD glass and coatings were as good as the Victory.......it was just the diopter settings, eyepieces and aluminium body that reduced costs.

 

[Steve C]

My understanding was that the alpha model (Victory's) were always intended to be made in their European factories while the Conquest (of any variety) were Japan and the Terras? Well...not sure on the latter.

I would hope that quality control would hold true regardless but I doubt it. My thinking.
Thus,...when I look at Alpha binoculars, I know they are made with quality and go out the door with a thorough inspection (each and every one of them). The further down the line you go, you take your chances.

Not sure how this compares to other companies such as Swaro so can't respond to that. But I am guessing that some brands (Vortex etc) ...lack quality control big time.

The Terra is Chinese sourced. While it is a decent glass, it is probably a non repairable Zeiss specced throw away glass with the blue badge.

 

[Steve C]

I was lead to believe that the Conquest HD glass and coatings were as good as the Victory.......it was just the diopter settings, eyepieces and aluminium body that reduced costs.

That will likely be the end point of any search into the matter. Each piece of glass will have a certain specification for optical quality and coating prescription. The specs are very likely at least nearly identical, varying perhaps in factory location, or potential differences dictated by different design. For instance an identical spec piece of glass from Shott in Germany, or Schott from one of its other plants.

 

[Ian Byrnes]

That will likely be the end point of any search into the matter. Each piece of glass will have a certain specification for optical quality and coating prescription. The specs are very likely at least nearly identical, varying perhaps in factory location, or potential differences dictated by different design. For instance an identical spec piece of glass from Shott in Germany, or Schott from one of its other plants.

So I also have a pair of Vanguard Endeavor EDII (8x42) with Hoya glass...... Will that be equal, inferior or better than Schott. To my untrained eyes, the image seems equally as good as my Conquest (10x42).

With Zeiss are you paying for better glass, better build or the name?

 

[Sebzwo]

As a customer I want to know where something was built. Any country is acceptable but I don't want to be misled. I think the laws need to be more specified. There is too much fooling around possible. There is nothing wrong with Asia at all to me. I just don't want to read (and pay for) made in Germany while it was made elsewhere. I see this becoming some major consumer topic in the future. Companies should actively clarify what is going on. Like Leica does with their (good quality) Portugal factory.

 

[Steve C]

So I also have a pair of Vanguard Endeavor EDII (8x42) with Hoya glass...... Will that be equal, inferior or better than Schott. To my untrained eyes, the image seems equally as good as my Conquest (10x42).

With Zeiss are you paying for better glass, better build or the name?

The Vanguard Endeavor ED II has a set of design specifications. The set of specified optical qualities do not require they be made by one manufacturer. Schott or Hoya glass for each individual piece is not the point. The specified quality is the point. Any glass manufacturer can make any number of differing quality levels. Optical glass is a chemical recipe. Each different type and quality has differing recipe ingredients. Moving up from the ED II price level to the Zeiss Conquest HD will require the use of different specifications. The rising quality needs for better performance comes at a cost. So if a piece in an ED II is compared to the corresponding piece in the Conquest HD, and if they both come from Hoya, they will not necessarily be the same quality. It probably makes no difference if the glass comes from Schott or any other source different from Hoya.

As for better glass, better build, or name. The glass at every price or performance is going to be nearly the same level (within the same level). The build is probably assumed to be there (most glass at the Conquest HD level is pretty well built). There is a you tube video showing a Zeiss Conquest HD being dragged down the road and being blown off a stump, not once, but twice, with a shotgun. Pretty substantial build to stand up to that I think . Much rides in the Zeiss blue label. People's expectations are a large factor here.

You are exactly right about your eyes. Most eyes have considerable difficulty discerning whole lot of difference between different binoculars. Zeiss dropped the price levels to provide the Zeiss label at more affordable levels to sell more Zeiss labels. The thing is, if you want the "comfort" of a Zeiss label, but don't have the money for the top end, you can now accomplish the feat for less money. If the label is not something that concerns you a whole lot, you are likely perfectly fine with the ED II. Most people are maybe better off buying a decent glass that fits their needs and just going out and using the glass. Start picking nits and I guarantee you will find the nits to pick over. Sometimes that seems the reason for the existence of the binocular forum here.

Edit: I think there needs to be truth in advertising. If it says "Made in Germany" or whatever country, then it should be made there. The standard may well never be 100%, but it can be much higher than 10%, or simply made functional.