Avian phylogeny (1 Viewer)

[Acanthis]

"Family Recurvirostridae (avocettes et échasses)
Subfamily Himantopodinae
Subfamily Recurvirostrinae
Family Ibidorhynchidae (bec-d'ibis)
Family Haematopodidae (huitriers)"

Am I the only one who combines all of these into one 'weird plover' family?

 

[Jim LeNomenclatoriste]

Is there a particular paper dealing with Elanidae specifically?
I'd noted the early divergence but hesitated to apply it to my own list without some justification in terms of biology, behaviour, morphology etc.

Old and Cosmopolite: Molecular Phylogeny of Tropical–Subtropical Kites (Aves: Elaninae) with Taxonomic Implications

Kites of the Elaninae group are small and medium-sized, mostly tropical raptors traditionally considered as an early diverged subfamily of the Accipitridae. We used nucleotide sequences of three genetic markers (mitochondrial Cyt b and COI, nuclear RAG-1) to reconstruct the phylogenetic...

www.mdpi.com

 

[Jim LeNomenclatoriste]

"Family Recurvirostridae (avocettes et échasses)
Subfamily Himantopodinae
Subfamily Recurvirostrinae
Family Ibidorhynchidae (bec-d'ibis)
Family Haematopodidae (huitriers)"

Am I the only one who combines all of these into one 'weird plover' family?

Surely

 

[Acanthis]

Surely

Haha, good!

 

[Acanthis]

"Family Rhynchotidae (nothures)
Family Tinamidae (tinamous)"

First I've seen this but i believe there is a deep divergence and an ecological separation into "open-country tinamous" and "forest tinamous".

 

[Mysticete]

Suggested by Sun & al. (2017)

(PDF) Rapid and recent diversification patterns in Anseriformes birds: Inferred from molecular phylogeny and diversification analyses

PDF | The Anseriformes is a well-known and widely distributed bird order, with more than 150 species in the world. This paper aims to revise the... | Find, read and cite all the research you need on ResearchGate

www.researchgate.net

Thanks! looks like I need to do some updating of my taxonomy!

 

[Mysticete]

"Family Rhynchotidae (nothures)
Family Tinamidae (tinamous)"

First I've seen this but i believe there is a deep divergence and an ecological separation into "open-country tinamous" and "forest tinamous".

Yeah this is also a novel one for me, although they have been recognized as subfamilies

 

[Jim LeNomenclatoriste]

Someone knows the divergence time between the Surniinae and the Striginae. The guy of the website estimate that around 30 mya, it's very deep

Someone can answer to my question please?🤣🤣

 

[Acanthis]

Thanks! looks like I need to do some updating of my taxonomy!

Ditto

 

[mb1848]

Megapodiiforme used in a review of Sibley and Monroe in a 1992 Auk.
Page 942 of https://sora.unm.edu/sites/default/files/journals/auk/v109n04/p0939-p0948.pdf .
S&M meant "Order Megapodiiformes" rather than. "Order Galliformes" for the clade comprising Craci and Megapodii

 

[Jim LeNomenclatoriste]

Okay, I had misread the figure. In fact, he suggests Megapodiiformes only for Megapodiidae

 

[Acanthis]

"Family Fringillidae (pinsons)
Family Euphoniidae (organistes)
Family Carduelidae (chardonnerets, tarins, roselins, bec-croisés, verdiers, serins, gros-becs, bouvreuils
Subfamily Coccothraustinae
Subfamily Pyrrhulinae
Subfamily Carduelinae"

Not sure I can forgive this dismemberment of my beloved "true finches".😁
But it does bring them more in line with the treatment of all the other 9-primaried oscines.
There's some symmetry in that.

 

[Jim LeNomenclatoriste]

"Family Fringillidae (pinsons)
Family Euphoniidae (organistes)
Family Carduelidae (chardonnerets, tarins, roselins, bec-croisés, verdiers, serins, gros-becs, bouvreuils
Subfamily Coccothraustinae
Subfamily Pyrrhulinae
Subfamily Carduelinae"

Not sure I can forgive this dismemberment of my beloved "true finches".😁
But it does bring them more in line with the treatment of all the other 9-primaried oscines.
There's some symmetry in that.

Here is the extremism of the extremism 🤣🤣🤣

I left them in subfamily in one family

 

[Jim LeNomenclatoriste]

In this PDF, I give 2 classifications of living birds. The first is classical (or almost), the second is more rational but less extreme than previously published.

 

[Mysticete]

In this PDF, I give 2 classifications of living birds. The first is classical (or almost), the second is more rational but less extreme than previously published.

Your first list is the closest to mine, the only major differences i could see is my recognition of Scleruridae, Dendrocolaptidae, Nestoridae, and lumping Pluvialidae in with Charadriidae (more recent phylogenies seem to unite them as a monophyletic group) and Herpetotheridae in with Falconidae. More differences at the subfamily level, but this might be less to do with differences in opinion as me needing to do more research on groups I am less familiar with. I am sure this will inspire me to re-examine some things, and there are a few groups that feel a bit borderline and I keep elevating and lumping depending upon my mood.

 

[TomDerutter]

Just for fun, this is what it would look like with a cut-off point on +-56mya (families just for information)
This is actually rather close to a more traditional view

tldr:

• Struthioniformes split in 2
• Merge Phoenicopteriformes & Podicipediformes
• Charadriiformes split in 2
• Merge Steatornithiformes & Nyctibiiformes
• Merge Aegotheliformes & Apodiformes
• Merge Columbiformes & Cuculiformes
• Merge Mesitornithiformes & Pterocliformes

Order STRUTHIONIFORMES
Family Struthionidae

Order APTERYGIFORMES
Family Rheidae
Family Casuariidae
Family Apterygidae
Family Tinamidae

Order ANSERIFORMES
Family Anhimidae
Family Anseranatidae
Family Anatidae

Order GALIIFORMES
Family Megapodiidae
Family Cracidae
Family Numididae
Family Odontophoridae
Family Phasianidae

Order PHOENICOPTERIFORMES
Family Phoenicopteridae
Family Podicipedidae

Order GRUIFORMES
Family Psophiidae
Family Aramidae
Family Gruidae
Family Sarothruridae
Family Heliornithidae
Family Rallidae

Order CHARADRIIFORMES
Family Pluvianellidae
Family Chionidae
Family Burhinidae
Family Pluvianidae
Family Recurvirostridae
Family Ibidorhynchidae
Family Haematopodidae
Family Charadriidae

Order LIMICOLIFORMES
Family Pedionomidae
Family Thinocoridae
Family Rostratulidae
Family Jacanidae
Family Scolopacidae
Family Turnicidae
Family Dromadidae
Family Glareolidae
Family Stercorariidae
Family Alcidae
Family Laridae

Order OPISTHOCOMIFORMES
Family Opisthocomidae

Order CAPRIMULGIFORMES
Family Caprimulgidae

Order STEATORNITHIFORMES
Family Steatornithidae
Family Nyctibiidae

Order PODARGIFORMES
Family Podargidae

Order APODIFORMES
Family Aegothelidae
Family Hemiprocnidae
Family Apodidae
Family Trochilidae

Order MUSOPHAGIFORMES
Family Musophagidae

Order OTIDIFORMES
Family Otididae

Order COLUMBIFORMES
Family Columbidae
Family Cuculidae

Order PTEROCLIFORMES
Family Mesitornithidae
Family Pteroclidae

Order PHAETHONTIFORMES
Family Phaethontidae

Order EURYPYGIFORMES
Family Eurypygidae
Family Rhynochetidae

Order GAVIIFORMES
Family Gaviidae

Order SPHENICIFORMES
Family Spheniscidae

Order PROCELLARIIFORMES
Family Diomedeidae
Family Oceanitidae
Family Hydrobatidae
Family Procellariidae

Order CICONIIFORMES
Family Ciconiidae

Order SULIFORMES
Family Fregatidae
Family Sulidae
Family Anhingidae
Family Phalacrocoracidae

Order PELECANIFORMES
Family Scopidae
Family Balaenicipitidae
Family Pelecanidae
Family Threskiornithidae
Family Ardeidae

Order CATHARTIFORMES
Family Cathartidae

Order ACCIPITRIFORMES
Family Sagittariidae
Family Pandionidae
Family Accipitridae

Order STRIGIFORMES
Family Tytonidae
Family Strigidae

Order COLIIFORMES
Family Coliidae

Order LEPTOSOMIFORMES
Family Leptosomidae

Order TROGONIFORMES
Family Trogonidae

Order BUCEROTIFORMES
Family Upupidae
Family Phoeniculidae
Family Bucorvidae
Family Bucerotidae

Order CORACIIFORMES
Family Meropidae
Family Brachypteraciidae
Family Coraciidae
Family Todidae
Family Momotidae
Family Alcedinidae

Order PICIFORMES
Family Galbulidae
Family Bucconidae
Family Indicatoridae
Family Picidae

Order CARIAMIFORMES
Family Cariamidae

Order FALCONIFORMES
Family Falconidae

Order PSITTACIFORMES
Family Strigopidae
Family Cacatuidae
Family Psittacidae
Family Psittaculidae

Order PASSERIFORMES
...

 

[Jim LeNomenclatoriste]

Your first list is the closest to mine, the only major differences i could see is my recognition of Scleruridae, Dendrocolaptidae, Nestoridae, and lumping Pluvialidae in with Charadriidae (more recent phylogenies seem to unite them as a monophyletic group) and Herpetotheridae in with Falconidae. More differences at the subfamily level, but this might be less to do with differences in opinion as me needing to do more research on groups I am less familiar with. I am sure this will inspire me to re-examine some things, and there are a few groups that feel a bit borderline and I keep elevating and lumping depending upon my mood.

This is what Boyd says about the Pluvialidae.

« This has been called into question by Baker et al. (2012), who argue that the plovers are a monophyletic group. I find their arugments (sic) unconvincing as they seem to ultimately depend on only 2 of 17 genes examined. To make this a bit clearer, suppose we think of the Charadrii as consisting of 4 groups: Egyptian Plover, Golden-Plovers, Avocets and allies, and the main plover/dotterel group. It's clear that the Egyptian Plover is in the basal branch. But which group branches next? Support for any of the three alternatives is relatively weak: One nuclear intron (GAPD3-5) supports the Golden-Plovers. Three genes (ND2, ADH5, and cyt-b) support the main plover group as basal, and two genes support the avocet group. The results from the other 11 genes are too inconclusive to score. Under these circumstances, I think it is best to put the three groups in a trichotomy.»


More studies found that Pluvialidae are not closely related to Charadriidae but basal the stilt/oystercatcher lineage

 

[Jim LeNomenclatoriste]

Order LIMICOLIFORMES

Shouldn't we be using a order name that begins with the same stem as a family name?

 

[TomDerutter]

Shouldn't we be using a order name that begins with the same stem as a family name?

I noticed Boyd uses Limicoli as suborder name instead of Scolopaci

The term Scolopaci (Strauch 1978?) seems to be the current fashion. However, Limicoli has a lot of priority and a long history of use (often as Limicolae).

He also has Plataleiformes which only includes Threskiornithidae, so it's definitely not a rule to use the same stem

 

[Jim LeNomenclatoriste]

He also has Plataleiformes which only includes Threskiornithidae, so it's definitely not a rule to use the same stem

But based on Platalea, a real genus. Which is not really the case with Limicoli.🧐