Old world oriole vs. New world oriole (1 Viewer)

[Melanie]

Both are in two different families: Oriolidae and Icteridae. But both share the same English name? Why?

 

[davercox]

Don't know Melanie but it's not unusual: when N America was first settled by English-speakers, they attached familiar names to birds that are now known to be in different families - "robin", "sparrow", "blackbird" etc - and some of these names persist. I guess you knew that very well - what's different about orioles ?

 

[Melanie]

When Linnaeus described the first troupial he named it Oriolus icterus. So I guess that it was previously thought that troupials and orioles are closely related because they look slightly similar.

 

[Rick Wright]

When Linnaeus described the first troupial he named it Oriolus icterus. So I guess that it was previously thought that troupials and orioles are closely related because they look slightly similar.

It's a great question: Is the English "oriole" in its American application a folk name or a book name? Seems to me, with no time to look into it, that all the early attestations of "oriole" = Icterus are in scientific contexts, not popular. So "oriole" took a different cultural and linguistic route than "robin," "blackbird," etc., which came to America in the mouths of normal people.

A quick scan of Peters finds half a dozen current Icterus orioles originally named Oriolus. The synonymies in Brisson remind us that at least some troupials were originally described as woodpeckers in the genus Picus, too.

Thanks for raising this, Melanie! Let us know if you follow up on it.

 

[Melanie]

This thread should belong to bird name etymology. Can an admin move this thread to the correct category?

 

[James Jobling]

The English name oriole was first applied specifically to the Golden Oriole Oriolus oriolus in 1776 by Pennant (British Zool., ed. iv, vol. ii) (see SOED, 1944, ed. III, vol. II, p. 1386, and Lockwood 1984, p. 111). The tropical American orioles were first known as hangnests, troopials and pies; in North America Lawson 1709 gave the name Baltimore bird to the Baltimore Oriole Icterus galbula, and Catesby 1731 repeated that name and also provided Bastard Baltimore for the Orchard Oriole Icterus spurius (see Feduccia 1985, pp. 9, 129-132). Pennant 1785 (Arctic Zool., vol. ii, pp. 255+) gave the names Baltimore Oriole and Bastard Oriole, and also used oriole for other icterids, thus confirming in these contexts that oriole was a book name. The use of oriole reflected the orange, yellow and black plumages.

 

[Melanie]

Hi James,

thanks for the explanation. It's also interesting to know that the name oriole refers to the plumage. But I think the use of the name oriole can still cause confusion especially among non-English-speakers. If you translate the name European Golden Oriole in other languages it is called "Pirol" in German and "Loriot" in French. And I guess if a non-English-speaker with no taxonomic or nomenclature knowledge will translate e.g. the Montserrat oriole into German it could be that he will say "Montserratpirol" because he has in mind that oriole is "pirol" in his mother language.

 

[James Jobling]

The English name oriole, derived from Old French oriol and Mediaeval Latin aureolus (c. 1150) and oriolus (<1446), is an onomatopoeia, imitative of the male Golden Oriole's flute-like call. The word has been mistakenly interpreted as if from Latin aureolus golden (see Lockwood 1984, p. 111, and Latham 2012 (reprint with Suppl.), p. 38). I do not think birders will be confused by the use of this epithet for two different families of birds; what about warbler, flycatcher, finch, chat and robin? That is what scientific names are for.