Nuthatch age/sex/race UK (1 Viewer)

[Jane Turner]

I see very few Nuthatches - but the one I saw today struck me as being unusually white underneath. It circled high for 10 mins, came down for a few seconds, circled again, tried a different aerial then left high west. There appeared to be white on the forehead and over the eye too.

 

[RecoveringScot]

Fairly good match for the Scandinavian Nuthatch (supercilium flaring behind the eye) in Collins Bird Guide though I know nothing about plumage variation in European N in Britain and don't know how likely that would be. The Guide says nothing about migration or vagrancy, except smaller Russian/Siberian ones turning up in Finland. There have been a lot of easterly/north-easterly winds here this spring (with recent good results from that direction). Probably pretty unlikely. So I dunno basically. Looks too 'clean' to be leucistic, but that seems most likely.

 

[P.Sunesen]

Of course much more likely to be caesia, but it does look very pale indeed. The bill seems quite short, and doesn't it seem to have pale c.o.m.?
If so, it could perhaps be a just independent, dispersing/disorientated juvenile. This might explain the pale underside, but I have little experience with caesia juvenile.

Peter

 

[Andy Hurley]

Iit looks more like a Fenno Scandia europaea as it lacks the obvious white super (photo 1, although in photo 2 it is more apparent). The vent has some colour , but it is difficult to say exactly what degree and shade with any accuracy and there doesn't appear to be any deviation on the upper parts, this points in favour towards a Scandanavian bird rather than leucism, imo (I don't know if diet can affect colour production in the red spectrum, but its lack is unlikely to explain the variation in all the Fenno Scanda population, genetics sounds far more plausible.)

 

[RecoveringScot]

Hi Andy,

I personally think it could be Scandinavian, but was being ultra-cautious, speaking from a position of almost total ignorance! As soon as I'm positive about any tricky ID, doubts flood in immediately.

Cheers

 

[Andy Hurley]

Hi Andy,

I personally think it could be Scandinavian, but was being ultra-cautious, speaking from a position of almost total ignorance! As soon as I'm positive about any tricky ID, doubts flood in immediately.

Cheers

I know what you mean, I tend to look for local alternatives before I shout accidental/rarity, but looking at it logically, in all likelyhood, it won't be a Siberian bird, and Scandanavia is not that far away.

 

[Jane Turner]

Of course much more likely to be caesia, but it does look very pale indeed. The bill seems quite short, and doesn't it seem to have pale c.o.m.?
If so, it could perhaps be a just independent, dispersing/disorientated juvenile. This might explain the pale underside, but I have little experience with caesia juvenile.

Peter

The bill looked thin and short to me..... certainly and odd bird. On the off chance of voice being helpful - I have a few minutes of flight call recorded!

 

[lou salomon]

i think i remember that juvs can look much paler than adults. this looks like a juvenile.

 

[RecoveringScot]

Here's an 'extraordinary sighting' of a Nuthatch from the Isle of Wight, of a bird showing apparently only faint buffish on the belly and flanks (scroll down to March 15th), but notice the thinner and more extended supercilium than in Jane's bird thus resembling British birds more:

http://wightvogels.web44.net/news.html

I've done some fiddling wih Jane's photo in GIMP. The only faint buffish tones are peripheral and seem to be reflections of sunlight. Jane's bird also seems to have dark carpal feathers where one would expect to see it on Scandinavian birds - the Bird Guide shows this as lacking on British birds. All this is rambling of course.

Cheers

 

[RecoveringScot]

Ageing and sexing info:

http://www.ibercajalav.net/img/395_NuthatchSeuropaea.pdf

Cheers

 

[paul moore]

How far west did it fly!?

Paul

 

[Jane Turner]

It headed out across the Dee about 500ft up and I lost it.

 

[AlfArbuthnot]

It's a normal British juvenile. They are much paler below than adults (whitish as opposed to buff), with a weaker facial pattern, and they are also dispersing round about now - the main dispersal is just 1-2 weeks after fledging. June is the time of year when you expect to see juveniles in out-of-the-ordinary places. Nice observation though, as they're usually seen just bobbing along hedgerows etc. Seeing one fly high across a river is unusual. Although would it really be 500 ft up? Height is hard to judge, but that's extremely high.

Here's a British juvenile to compare: http://www.foxglovecovert.org.uk/images/blog/c7IMG_5981.jpg

 

[Jane Turner]

It went out of view upwards - agree its hard to judge