Mobile phone mast dangers?? (1 Viewer)

[Reader]

As I was driving home from work a short report on the Heart FM 4pm news programme caught my attention. It was regarding the fact that protesters at Wythall had won their battle to have the mobile phone mast re-sited elswhere.

I think it was about 18 months ago that this mast was torn down and protesters would not allow anyone to put it back up again. Obviously it went to court and, as I said earler, they won the battle to stop it being erected again.

What really caught my attention was when they spoke to a local woman about it and her comments really struck home.

Apparently after the mast had been pulled down and put out of commision two things were noted. 3 babies were born and it had been years since a new born was seen in the village and a tree has started to grow leaves, the first time this has happened for at least ten years.

If this is true, and I don't doubt what the lady has stated, what damage around the country are these masts causing. What, if anything, could happen to our wildlife, including our birds that we cherish.

Has anyone else come across such incidents linked to these masts?

 

[Pie Face]

We've got one in the yard at work. So far no leaves have fallen off the trees next to it - at least four babies have been conceived and a pair of Blue Tits have nested on it every year.

Mark

 

[Edward woodwood]

what problem? say this lot:

http://www.zyra.org.uk/phonmast.htm

this problem! say this lot:

http://www.equilibra.uk.com/emfnewinfo.shtml

mmmmm...... they do make yer ears warm though!

 

[Reader]

what problem? say this lot:

http://www.zyra.org.uk/phonmast.htm

this problem! say this lot:

http://www.equilibra.uk.com/emfnewinfo.shtml

mmmmm...... they do make yer ears warm though!

Thanks for that Tim

I suppose it's a question of "you pays your money and take your choice".

I have read all of the link for the pro argument and a good amount of the anti argument. The former seems to generalise without facts whereas the latter seems to be able to use facts to establish there stance.

I didn't really have an opinion either way until today and now I am feeling a tad bit wary about where these are sited.

I take M N Reeders point in that there appears to be no problem where one is sited near to him but there does seem a lot of opinion against them.

I suppose it is a question of "watch this space".

 

[John N]

It seems like a vicious circle. None of us want a mast, but nearly all of us use a mobile. What is the answer?

 

[Dixie]

Let's ask the Woodland Trust about it...

There is liable to be a mobile phone mast erected in Woodland Trust land, near me, pretty soon as the planning application has been passed. Perhaps we can ask the Woodland Trust to do some research on the effect on birds nesting nearby.

I did see some information about EMFs and fledglings on the internet. It looks like EMFs cause melatonin levels within adult birds and fledglings to fluctuate. This can cause problems with the molt and could lead to migration problems as well.

Dixie

 

[Rasmus Boegh]

The problem is that there are virtually no studies on the actual damage caused by such radiation made by people without a pre-fixed agenda (either pro or con). The internet is loaded with such stories and "science" (read: bogus!). This is obvious when actually reading the various studies and seeing the amout of variation in the conclusions reached in seemingly similar studies. However, one thing is a fact: Having a mobile phone mast near your house only leads to a minor level of radiation (not that a any level is likely to be good) compared to the level you are subjected to by household objects that most wouldn't live without.

So, if you have a cell phone (see the short article in the first link given by Tim Allwood in post #3) or sit in front of a screen this second... you might want to get rid of those before you try getting rid of the nearby mobile phone mast. Likewise with nuclear radiation. When complaining many people seem to forget that one of the main reasons for a rise in background radiation in city enviroments is... concrete (due to the mineralised sands it contain; 1-2000 Bq/kg)! So, for humans at least, I am of the opinion that mobile phone mast is a minor problem for us - rather, we should worry about the cell phone we hold right next to our ear (similar levels of radiation at that distance have been proven to cause a change in the cell nucleus in rats). However, the situation is obviously very different for birds as they are likely to perch right next to or even on a mast. I would be very interested in reading an article on this, but so far have found none that seemed convincing and had a thorough scientific approach.

 

[Dixie]

There are lots of studies out there showing changes in laboratory animals from exposure to EMFs. Would this not show that there is likely to be damage to wildlife living in or around these masts, especially, I would imagine, to creatures which live more or less on the same level as the antenna, and probably in close proximity? I think this is something that should be studied much more closely.

 

[Rasmus Boegh]

There are lots of studies out there showing changes in laboratory animals from exposure to EMFs.

Yes, there are loads of test showing changes in cells due to electromagnetic fields - just about everybody agrees on that part. However, there's a significant difference between the various rays, the distance to the source and the amount of radiation. I am not aware of any tests made by serious scientists simulating the relatively low levels emitted from a mobile phone mast. The nearest I know is an article in Science (if my memory serves me right) that simulated the use of a cell phone - and, as mentioned earlier, they were able to show changes in the cell nucleus in rats (although it remained unanswered if the mutations were significant enough to cause cancer or alike - regardless, it quite certainly wasn't good!). But this was prolonged use at a distance of only a few centimeters. If anyone can point me in the direction of a scientific paper (published in a respectable magazine, of course) where they simulated the exposure a bird (or similar) would be likely to experiance from a cell phone mast I would be pleased to know about it. Most birds would only have a very limited exposure because they rarely stay in a small area for a prolonged period. However, a Passerine with a territory centered near a mast and/or a bird choosing a nest-site near (or perhaps even on) a mast are obviously in a very different situation. Furthermore, it would be interesting to know if some birds deliberately avoid areas with masts - especially those migrant species that are known for being exceptional sensitive to electromagnetic fields.

 

[Mickymouse]

I agree with Rasmus, I think he has said it all, except for the matter of visual amenity which bothers me more, a silly example perhaps but in a place called Herne Bay they had the most attractive water tower you have ever seen in your life now it is completely ruined with a growth of various antennae, I expect the angel of the north will eventualy sprout them.

Mick

 

[Arunav]

In India mobile phones damage the health of the common sparrows. In the last four years,(according to a recent study) the population has gone down half since a count in 1995.

Also India has the second highest user market and the fastest developing market of mobile phones. Also many small migrant species of small birds( eg house swallow, pied crested cuckoo) stoped coming here in mumbai, and have relocated themselves about 100 km away.

Remarkalbly, the house crow has developed immunity agains mobile phones, and seem dominant here. They are killing other small species.

 

[Rasmus Boegh]

In India mobile phones damage the health of the common sparrows. In the last four years,(according to a recent study) the population has gone down half since a count in 1995.

Also India has the second highest user market and the fastest developing market of mobile phones. Also many small migrant species of small birds( eg house swallow, pied crested cuckoo) stoped coming here in mumbai, and have relocated themselves about 100 km away.

Remarkalbly, the house crow has developed immunity agains mobile phones, and seem dominant here. They are killing other small species.

I would like to see studies confirming above. It is easy to draw conclusions based on connections that are "less than accurate". A good example that has been mentioned frequently: On average people from Greenland drink less milk than Danes do. The rate of cancer is lower in Greenland that in Denmark. Thus, milk is to blame for cancer. Of course this has nothing to do with the truth, but it is a good example of how easy you can draw mistaken conclusions if not having the complete picture. I am very well aware of the drop in Sparrows, not only in India, but in a large part of Europe, too. However, I have NOT SEEN A SINGLE SCIENTIFIC STUDY indicating mobile phones (or rather the masts) are to blame. While the issue still is rather poorly known, the main reasons seem to be a change in agriculture. Furthermore, all studies I know of (incl. one still unpublished I reviewed just a few weeks ago) indicate that Corvids often are highly successful due to their adaptability, which in turn is linked to their relatively high level of intelligence (i.e. nothing to do with "immunity" to mobile masts). Regardless, as mentioned previously, if you indeed can point me in the direction of good scientific studies confirming above, I would be very pleased to receive a reference.

 

[streatham]

Hi All,

I would imagine the problem of tower strikes on communication masts for migrating birds would be more of an issue than the one of radiation from the masts themslves? Perhaps in the UK they are sticking the masts on existing structures (as Mick says) so it is less of an issue?

Luke

 

[everaert_joris]

Hello,

I am a biologist from Belgium, and did a field study this year on the possible effect of electromagnetic fields from mobile phone base stations on the distribution of breeding House Sparrows (see below).
But first some links to interesting studies.

-"Possible effects of electromagnetic fields from phone masts on a population of White Stork". Published in Electromagnetic Biology and Medicine 2005, 24: 109-119.
http://www.powerwatch.org.uk/news/20051006_storks.pdf

See also the studies in the References of this article, and
http://www.hese-project.org/de/emf/...Author.php?lang=de&target=Balmori_Dr._Alfonso

-Changes in neural activity from pulsed microwave fields (900 MHz carrier, modulated at 217 Hz) in Zebra Finches were found, but whether these responses by the central nervous system manifested the birds behaviour or it’s health, is unknown.
"Responses of neurons to an amplitude modulated microwave stimulas". Published in Neuroscience Letters 2002, 33: 175-178.
http://www.buergerwelle.de/pdf/beasond_semm_reponses_of_neurons.pdf

-Effect on reproductive capacity of insects (Drosophila)...
(could be an indirect effect for birds)
Published in Electromagnetic Biology and Medicine, 2004, 23: 29-43.
http://www.buergerwelle.de/pdf/ebm_28875_article_pdf_panagopoulos-2004.pdf

More (general) info for example on

http://www.buergerwelle.de/body_science.html

Some official studies and "anecdotical" stories on
animals
http://members.aol.com/gotemf/emf/animals.htm

and many studies on Stopumts (in Dutch)
http://www.stopumts.nl/doc.php/Onderzoeken/83
or (less info) in English
http://www.stopumts.nl/english.php

http://www.mikrowellensmog.info/

http://www.microwavenews.com/

http://www.powerwatch.org.uk/


As for my own research.
In April 2006, I performed a study with a portable spectrum analyser.
I still need to analyse some results and I just started writing an article for publication. But for your information, here already a "preliminary abstract".
I will post more info in the forum when my article is ready.

"A possible effect of electromagnetic fields from mobile phone base stations on the distribution of breeding House Sparrows was studied in 5 residential districts in Flanders (Belgium). The presence of House Sparrows was determined using the ‘point transect’ method. From 150 counting points, a significant negative correlation (p<0.00001) was found between the number of House Sparrows (males) and the electric field strength from nearby mobile phone GSM base stations (900 and 1800 MHz downlink). The mean number of male House Sparrows was 1.55 in one group of 75 points with electrical field strength less than 0.17 V/m, and 0.91 in the other group of 75 points with electrical field strength more than 0.17 V/m. The difference in the number of House Sparrows between the two groups was significantt (U=1948; p<0.005; Mann-Whitney U test), indicating that the distribution of breeding House Sparrows is influenced by the electromagnetic fields from mobile phone base stations."

Of course, a correlation doen't mean that the effect is caused by the phone masts. It is possible, but more research is needed.

Best regards,
Joris Everaert (M.Sc.)
Belgium
private email: [email protected]

If anyone can point me in the direction of a scientific paper (published in a respectable magazine, of course) where they simulated the exposure a bird (or similar) would be likely to experiance from a cell phone mast I would be pleased to know about it. Most birds would only have a very limited exposure because they rarely stay in a small area for a prolonged period. However, a Passerine with a territory centered near a mast and/or a bird choosing a nest-site near (or perhaps even on) a mast are obviously in a very different situation. Furthermore, it would be interesting to know if some birds deliberately avoid areas with masts - especially those migrant species that are known for being exceptional sensitive to electromagnetic fields.

 

[craig whitmore]

what problem? say this lot:

http://www.zyra.org.uk/phonmast.htm

this problem! say this lot:

http://www.equilibra.uk.com/emfnewinfo.shtml

mmmmm...... they do make yer ears warm though!

Hey Tim. Thanks a lot for your pro and con. :t:
Did you go through to the end of the con argument? That guy is a con all right. Bottom line is that he's using sudo scientific gobbledy gook trying to sell a bunch of gadgets that will protect us from everything imaginable. Go on to the end if you haven't and you will find the typical (literaly) shopping cart and check out.

Craig :flyaway:

 

[audouin]

My interest lies in whether or not mobilephone/telemetry masts and associated radiation
affects a birds orientation capability,