Hawk Trouble at my Bird Feeder (1 Viewer)

[Blue Bird Lover]

I had been happily feeding birds for several years until we moved to a new neighborhood. Unfortunately, I'm learning that the town we moved to is a hawk haven. (we are in Iowa, USA) We've been here for four years and this past year we've had a very persistent hawk that has been quite successful in terrorizing (and killing several Mourning Doves) our birds. I think it is either a Red Tail or a Cooper's Hawk. I have Gold Finch feeders at several locations in my yard and put Niger seed and corn on the ground for the doves. The numbers of doves have grown to around 30-40 early in the morning. The doves keep coming earlier (I think trying to eat before the hawk makes his dive bomb appearance), but the hawk is very smart and keeps coming earlier as well. I have been keeping a watch for the hawk in an attempt to scare it, but as you might guess, nothing has worked. I knock loudly on the window or run outside clapping and shouting. That scares him away for the time being, but it keeps coming back. I know the hawk needs to eat and this is part of nature, but I just really don't want to make the mourning doves easy targets. Does anyone have any suggestions for feeder placement or ways to make the hawk move on? Am I going to have to give up my passion of feeding the birds? I don't want to be cruel and selfish by continuing to feed them if there is no solution. Please let me know if anyone can give me advice. Thanks!

 

[ChrisKten]

I had been happily feeding birds for several years until we moved to a new neighborhood. Unfortunately, I'm learning that the town we moved to is a hawk haven. (we are in Iowa, USA) We've been here for four years and this past year we've had a very persistent hawk that has been quite successful in terrorizing (and killing several Mourning Doves) our birds. I think it is either a Red Tail or a Cooper's Hawk. I have Gold Finch feeders at several locations in my yard and put Niger seed and corn on the ground for the doves. The numbers of doves have grown to around 30-40 early in the morning. The doves keep coming earlier (I think trying to eat before the hawk makes his dive bomb appearance), but the hawk is very smart and keeps coming earlier as well. I have been keeping a watch for the hawk in an attempt to scare it, but as you might guess, nothing has worked. I knock loudly on the window or run outside clapping and shouting. That scares him away for the time being, but it keeps coming back. I know the hawk needs to eat and this is part of nature, but I just really don't want to make the mourning doves easy targets. Does anyone have any suggestions for feeder placement or ways to make the hawk move on? Am I going to have to give up my passion of feeding the birds? I don't want to be cruel and selfish by continuing to feed them if there is no solution. Please let me know if anyone can give me advice. Thanks!

I have Sparrowhawks visit on almost a daily basis, they are not always successful. I have witnessed many kills over the last few years, and it's not pleasant to watch.

Predators are, however, part of Nature, they keep things in balance. Without the predators many birds would die a lingering death from starvation or disease. It's very difficult at first, but you should try to observe Nature.

It has taken me a few years to stop myself from scaring the Hawks, now I feel privileged to witness such spectacular predators. But to be honest, it's still not easy to watch, and at times it's very unpleasant. You can try to site your feeders so it's not easy for Hawks, but removing the feeders will just punish the other birds.

I'm sure others here will advise on offering some cover for the birds. I'm in the UK so I'm not familiar with your native plants, or with what feeder types you have in your Country.

 

[razorsharp]

Predators can only live in areas where they have enough prey to support them, so having birds of prey around is a sign that you are living in an area where the local birds are thriving. You pointed out that you were getting up to forty doves at your feeder so it seems obvious that the hawk is taking the most common birds, and the birds thats numbers are least threatened.

Birds have survived for thousands of years alongside there predators, it's part of nature, if they were nor predators there would be to many birds to be supported by there food so they would starve and die. The hawks have to eat too and with increasing human population and urbanistaion there are less and less places for animals to move on too.

Please, feel privileged to have them, I rarely see Sparrowhawks, which are the birds that sometimes hunt at feeders over here and it is something I am sad about.

 

[Blue Bird Lover]

Thanks for the encouraging words. I don't know that I will ever feel okay about seeing a hawk kill one of the birds I'm feeding (even though hawks are beautiful birds). I think what's bothering me the most is that I'm making it easier for the hawk and putting the doves at a disadvantage by feeding too many in one place. The hawk swoops by or dive bombs from our roof several times a day. I'm really hoping someone can help me with the placement of my bird feeders. I think I'm putting too much food out which is attracting too many doves. (which is my fault) I've been putting Niger seed and cracked corn under my spruce and pine tree (they are only 5-6 feet right now as I planted them this past autumn), in a couple of feeder trays attached to the pole where the Gold Finch eat, and I have a tray under our deck. I know I need to stop feeding for a period of time to discourage the hawk, and then I'm wondering which feeding location I should keep after that. Any advice on discouraging hawks or protecting the songbirds in my yard would be greatly appreciated. Those of you who don't get to see hawks should come to Iowa. They are everywhere, even in the city, not to mention all of the eagles that are here this time of year. They are truly magnificent birds. I don't mind watching them have their fill of the fish in the rivers and lakes!

 

[razorsharp]

I can't remeber what way it goes. Leave the food out in the open so the birds can see all around them or leave it close to cover like trees or bushes so they have a place to hide in easily.

Whatever way it goes, there will still be some losses of birds which is part of nature. If you lessen the food they can catch, then it should be fair to the hawks to let them keep the meals you have made it harder for them to catch. I can't stress this enough, it's part of nature, if the food the hawk naturally eats in it's territory, happens to be in your garden it has no choice but to hunt there or starve. Prey animals usually escape more often than the predator makes a kill. Hawks don't kill for fun, they kill out of hunger so a hawk on a full stomach won't keep attacking your feeders, it will if you keep scaring it off.

 

[ChrisKten]

I can't remeber what way it goes. Leave the food out in the open so the birds can see all around them or leave it close to cover like trees or bushes so they have a place to hide in easily.

I think the latter is preferred, but then too "close to cover" can also be a good place for Cats to leap from. Whichever you choose the Hawks will soon work out a way to catch their prey.

Whatever way it goes, there will still be some losses of birds which is part of nature. If you lessen the food they can catch, then it should be fair to the hawks to let them keep the meals you have made it harder for them to catch. I can't stress this enough, it's part of nature, if the food the hawk naturally eats in it's territory, happens to be in your garden it has no choice but to hunt there or starve. Prey animals usually escape more often than the predator makes a kill. Hawks don't kill for fun, they kill out of hunger so a hawk on a full stomach won't keep attacking your feeders, it will if you keep scaring it off.

I agree with all of that

I'll just add that part of the problem is we have our favourites, there's nothing worse than feeding a bird by hand for weeks and then see it eaten alive by a Sparrowhawk. We find certain Birds "cute" when in fact they are all amazing creatures. Some of what they endure to survive is way beyond anything Man can ever hope to cope with.

So we need to observe, and admire, what we are priveligded to witness, instead of treating the Birds like our pets. I know, it's easier said than done, I've found giving certain birds a pet name makes it even harder

 

[Blue Bird Lover]

I do understand what you are saying and I agree the hawks need to eat. I just felt I was making it a little too easy with 30-40 doves sitting in one area. Don't hawks also eat mice and other rodents? I wonder if they are harder to find/catch? I have read about people treating their songbirds like pets and even naming them. I sure don't think of them that way. I just think of them as beautiful creatures and I don't want to witness them getting eaten by another bigger bird. I think when they are out in the wild they might have a better chance of hiding and read somewhere that all of the birdfeeders in backyards have made the hawks change their habits. I'm going to cut back on how much food I am putting out to limit the activity. I've heard both theories about putting the feeders out in the open and under cover. It sounds like under cover is better. Thankfully I've never seen a cat running loose in our neighborhood. We have a fenced yard which may not keep a cat away? I sure wish I could look at it more like some of you, but lately I've just been sad and the joy has gone out of it for me. I will work it out though; I can't give up feeding the birds. Thanks again everyone, I truly appreciate your advice.

 

[ChrisKten]

I sure wish I could look at it more like some of you, but lately I've just been sad and the joy has gone out of it for me. I will work it out though; I can't give up feeding the birds.

Just so you don't feel isolated, I went through a similar period a few months ago. At the time I was getting a bit depressed about the number of Sparrows and Starlings that I'd seen the Sparrowhawks take from my garden. When I got to the window to look they were either dead and then carried off, or dead and being eaten. I probably had about 20+ Sparrows and 20+ Starlings in the garden at that time, so I sort of accepted it as the numbers never seemed to decrease.

Then one day I saw a female Sparrowhawk eating a Collard Dove alive. It was in my neighbor's garden, so there was little I could do even if I wanted to. It was one of the worst things I have ever seen in Nature, especially as I suspected the Collard Dove was one I had got to trust me. I actually cried (I know, I'm a sad sod). After about 2 hours when there was nothing much left except the head, I decided that was it, I wouldn't feed the Birds anymore.

About 20 minutes later my garden was full of hungry Birds again, and I realised they seemed totally unaffected by what had just happened. They, including the remaining Collard Doves, just carried on trying to survive. So I decided if I wanted to help the Birds to survive I had to continue to feed them. I also had to learn to accept that Sparrowhawks are also trying to survive. I don't find it easy at all, but most of the time I do find it fascinating.


That's a short version of how I felt as this post is almost a Blog already.

 

[Blue Bird Lover]

After about 2 hours when there was nothing much left except the head, I decided that was it, I wouldn't feed the Birds anymore.

About 20 minutes later my garden was full of hungry Birds again, and I realised they seemed totally unaffected by what had just happened. They, including the remaining Collard Doves, just carried on trying to survive. So I decided if I wanted to help the Birds to survive I had to continue to feed them. I also had to learn to accept that Sparrowhawks are also trying to survive. I don't find it easy at all, but most of the time I do find it fascinating.

Thank you for the moral support. At least the hawk I have in my backyard is so big that it seems to kill them quickly. Once when I was looking out the window I saw it dive bomb near the feeder and there was just several feathers lying on the ground. He had quickly taken the dove and flown away. Judging by the force with which he hit the dove it surely killed it right on the spot. I think I am just in shock, because for the first three years we lived here, I only spotted a hawk once or twice and never witnessed it killing a bird. That's why I think feeding so many birds at once has caught their attention. I am going to start feeding them in different spots (not in the middle of the yard). The Gold Finches and Juncos seem totally unaffected. I think they are so small and quick they can escape in a hurry. A contact from our Department of Natural Resources advised me to stop feeding the birds for a couple of weeks and the hawk would likely move on. I was worried about stopping now with winter here and snow covering part of the ground. He said they can always find food. I'm going to just opt for finding better cover and continue feeding them. Thanks for all of the interesting conversation. I am really glad I joined this forum.

 

[lovebluejays]

a hawk literally tortured one of the blue jays that had just started coming to our feeder he was on the ground under it, it got quiet and the blue jay just stayed glued to the ground not moving and bamm a hawk landed on him barely bigger than the blue jay itself and was having trouble getting a good hold on him because of it, i have never heard such mournful cries from a bluejay till this day and it is still haunting me. i think this blue jay was young too. i also think the hawk would have tried to eat him alive right there too but we scared him off, it was awful,i do feel bad and don't think i could handle seeing that again. i always thought hawks killed there prey quick, why don't they? anyways how do you handle that,not to mention the next morning a sister or brother of the tortured blue jay was screaming at me when i looked out the window at him,almost thought it was related but found out our feeder was empty, we have a squirell proof feeder but a red squirell gets in there and eats all the peanuts,go figure.... but i love bluejays and always thought they could never get caught because of their size.... i am thinking of moving the feeder a little closer to the bushes. I feel for anyone who witnessed what i did.. what can i do? thanks for listening
new member

 

[fugl]

It would be helpful to know what kind of hawk is killing your doves. Red-tails--one possibility--are perch hunters & need a direct line-of-sight to their prey in order to catch anything. To protect your birds, place the feeders where the hawk can't see them from its hunting perches (of course, you first have to determine where these perches are). Defending against Cooper's Hawks--the most likely candidate in my view--is a lot tougher. Cooper's Hawks are stealth hunters, taking advantage of local "topography" to sneak up on their prey, coming at them suddenly out of nowhere over ridge, fence or hedgerow or around the corner of building. I don't know what the best anti-Cooper's tactic would be. I suspect it varies depending on the prey species, sparrows for example benefiting from nearby bushes to dive into, and bigger birds, like pigeons & doves, from open ground enabling them to see what's coming. But, I'm just guessing here & you'd have to experiment to find out anything definite.

But, I think, & as others have said, if you feed birds at all you're going to have to put with a certain amount of predation. It just comes with the territory. I've had numerous bird of prey kills over the years in my backyard, even though there's lots of cover. All the kills to the best of my knowledge have been by Cooper's Hawks & their relatives (Sharp-shinned Hawks & Northern Goshawks). The victims have been mostly California Quail & Mourning Doves but have also included a whole range of other species (starlings, House & White-crowned Sparrows, robins, Yellow-rumped Warblers, flickers & even a Northern Saw-whet Owl on one occasion). There are Red-tails in the neighborhood & I've seen the occasional Red-tailed kill (snakes, ground squirrels, domestic pigeons, cottontails) nearby but never actually in my backyard which seems safe from them.

 

[little liza]

Much more likely a Cooper's than a Red Tail. Red Tails rarely, if ever, eat birds on the wing. They usually hunt low to the ground for rodents and snakes. Coopers are aerial hunters and take birds regularly.
Are they taking the birds actually at the feeders, or as they are flying away from the feeders?

 

[lovebluejays]

I think it might have been a cooper hawk, it was brown with capped brown head about crow size,, the blue jay was a little ways out from under the feeder so i guess in plain sight for a hawk to see,that's why i think i should move the feeder up a little towards more cover... there are two bushes one on each side of the feeder so they do have cover,that's another thing why didn't he jump into the bush? Thank you all for responding so fast, i have been a birder for awhile now but i think this incident takes the cake for me i know it's nature and all but why can't these hawks land on em and break their necks first? i just hope not to see it any time soon again, i love all the birds we get !!

 

[little liza]

I think it might have been a cooper hawk, it was brown with capped brown head about crow size,

If it's about crow size, it's definitely not a red tail.

there are two bushes one on each side of the feeder so they do have cover,that's another thing why didn't he jump into the bush?

I think (but can't prove) that a bird's instinct is to use distance rather than cover. Coopers are so fast though, that few songbirds can get away.

Thank you all for responding so fast, i have been a birder for awhile now but i think this incident takes the cake for me i know it's nature and all

I lost an entire colony of purple martins in '07 to a great horned owl, and haven't been able to re-establish a colony yet. It's heart-breaking to deal with situations like yours, but it's a reality some of us have to deal with, unfortunately. You might consider putting your feeders in a more open area where the birds at the feeders have a large escape route rather than being limited on the routes they can take. I'm not sure it would be better, but it may be worth consideration.

 

[lovebluejays]

yeah i think i will try that, thank you Liza! all i have seen lately at my feeder is small birds,its hard to feed the blue jays with the feeder i have,squirrel proof the double sided one in order for blue jays to use it i have to put it on the heaviest setting and the red squirrel takes over and eats all the good stuff peanuts, stripes etc.. i was thinking of just getting whole corn to throw out for them,i used to feed them peanuts from grocery store but it was starting to get messy not to mention dirty look from neighbor. i cannot believe the price of birdseed today! i have been looking online for seed but its just as expensive.. what do you feed your birds? one blue jay has been twice but can't get on the feeder now changed setting due to the squirrel. i had three or four blue jays and now only one... sad. i just bought sunflower chips and big stripes from store and mixed it with some finch food i had,so far ime getting small birds,chipping sparrows,house sparrows,chickadees,cardinals i don't think they like the mix very well though they like safflower the best,when i started putting peanut pieces in the feeder is when i started getting blue jays again and nuthatches,the last mix i got from bird store was nut and berry with cashews and such...big mistake that's when squirrel came and stayed on feeder 24/7 it seemed like,but i guess he did drop some under feeder, blue jay was on ground alot then snatched away.. is it better to buy individual seed rather than mixes,well cheaper i mean? sorry this is so long..lol i love talking bout birds though

 

[little liza]

I usually keep four seed feeders up, four suet feeders, and two tray feeders(those are the ones that the jays visit). In one of the seed feeders, I have safflower seeds, in another one I have wild finch seed which is mix of white small millet and niger seed (for the painted buntings and house finches), one seed feeder has a mix of peanut, hulled sunflower, and pumpkin seeds, and the other is a screen feeder with black oil sunflower seeds (the titmice and chickadees use that one). In the tray feeders, one of them has a mix of striped and black sunflower seeds, and the other has large red millet and cracked corn. I have all of them hanging and attached to a tall post (if I knew how to post pix here, I would show you). My feeding station post has a "predator guard" made from sheet metal to prevent the squirrels and raccoons from climbing. So far, it works well.
For the squirrels, I have a large glass deep plate that I put the cracked corn and millet mix in (away from the bird feeders). The cracked corn and millet mix is available at Tractor Supply Company for 7-8 dollars per 50# bag. Well worth it imo. I buy most of my bird seed there, but the smaller seed varieties are pretty expensive except for the black oil sunflower seed which is around 15 dollars for 50#. If you have TSC stores in your area, go by and see if their prices are competitive. They are the best bang for the buck in this area, but it's still kind of expensive imo.

 

[little liza]

I took a pic a few minutes ago of the birdfeeders and birdbaths, and uploaded to the photo hosting site I use:

http://www.pbase.com/dragonfly/image/115899915

The predator guard is one that I fabricated from a piece of sheet metal, but you can use stove pipe for the same purpose. This method is commonly used by purple martin and blue bird landlords to keep predators out of the nest boxes. It's not pretty, but it is very functional. ||

 

[Amurfalcon]

Velocities

Coopers are so fast though, that few songbirds can get away.

This is especially true if the victim is sitting at a feeder and the Cooper's is coming in fast and already flying. Most birds take at least a second or two to get to their top speed when starting from the ground or feeder, so the bird would need a very fast reflex and good speed to escape a Cooper's chasing it in this situation.

 

[tippyhamm]

a hawk literally tortured one of the blue jays that had just started coming to our feeder he was on the ground under it, it got quiet and the blue jay just stayed glued to the ground not moving and bamm a hawk landed on him barely bigger than the blue jay itself and was having trouble getting a good hold on him because of it, i have never heard such mournful cries from a bluejay till this day and it is still haunting me. i think this blue jay was young too. i also think the hawk would have tried to eat him alive right there too but we scared him off, it was awful,i do feel bad and don't think i could handle seeing that again. i always thought hawks killed there prey quick, why don't they? anyways how do you handle that,not to mention the next morning a sister or brother of the tortured blue jay was screaming at me when i looked out the window at him,almost thought it was related but found out our feeder was empty, we have a squirell proof feeder but a red squirell gets in there and eats all the peanuts,go figure.... but i love bluejays and always thought they could never get caught because of their size.... i am thinking of moving the feeder a little closer to the bushes. I feel for anyone who witnessed what i did.. what can i do? thanks for listening
new member

I know just how you feel, bluejay. I have a Cooper's Hawk that has been residing in a tall willow tree in the back of our property and regularly gets mourning doves, bluejays, rabbits, etc. We also have parakeets that we hang outside in the warm weather. I looked out and saw the hawk on the birdcage so decided to cover with a towel to give the birds some cover but when I was removing the cage, it slipped out of my hand and smashed apart on my patio sending both birds flying in different directions. That Cooper's hawk came out of the trees like a bullet and took one of my birds right in front of me. As you can guess, I was horrified. Poor little bird didn't know what hit him.