Guidance on 10x30 binoculars (1 Viewer)

[JamesMorgan]

I am looking for some guidance on real life usage of 10x30 binoculars. I currently have a pair of 8x40 porro prism binoculars (about 15 years old, worth about £200 in today's money) and am looking for a second pair of binoculars. My typical usage is on walks of 4-8 miles and I regularly also have a camera for wildlife photography. My current binoculars are fine optically, but I find them a little large alongside my camera gear. I also find that on some of my walks they are a bit underpowered - especially coastal/salt marsh habitats. My thoughts are therefore to get a second pair of binoculars that are small enough to fit into my jacket pocket, but that also have 10x magnification.

I've tried out a few pairs in the shops (my favourites being Hawke Frontier ED X and Opticron Traveller BGA ED). From what I can tell in the confines of a shop, both pairs seem very good optically and are the right size to fit into my jacket pocket. Where I am less sure is whether having 10x magnification will make much difference in the field compared to my 8x. Where I currently struggle is identification of distant waders or gulls. I can usually id common birds (probably mainly from their jizz), but anything unusual becomes more of a challenge. I do have a spotting scope and on the rare occassions that I do smaller walks to a hide this works fine, but is not really practical on longer walks.

I therefore welcome any feedback on whether having 10x magnification makes that much difference in real life, especially comparing a 10x30 to the greater ocular lens of a 8x40.

 

[mwhogue]

James,
Pending more specific input from others, yes a 10x can make a real difference at long distance. Given your plan to use a small 10x30 I would spend as much as you reasonably can and unless the choice is clear, pick the one you can hold the steadiest as image shake can cancel out the benefits of increased magnification.

Let us know how it goes.

Mike

 

[Conndomat]

Hello James,

first of all, welcome on board ...

Maybe 10x25 pocket binoculars would make more sense for your area of application?
Some say the difference between 8x and 10x is very small, others say it is noticeable!
I find the difference, especially noticeable over long distances, and easy to calculate mathematically.

If you have a building at 1000m. When viewed from a distance with 10x binoculars, it looks as big as with the naked eye at 100m. In 8x binoculars it would be 125m. removed.
Everyone has to assess for themselves whether this gain in reach is sufficient.

The disadvantage is that 10x binoculars wobble significantly more and the actual range gain can no longer be exploited here, most things that can be seen with 10x can also be identified with 8x.

You should try it yourself, whether the 10x really bring a profit you can only find out for yourself in the end.

Andreas

 

[JamesMorgan]

Hello James,

first of all, welcome on board ...

Maybe 10x25 pocket binoculars would make more sense for your area of application?
Some say the difference between 8x and 10x is very small, others say it is noticeable!
I find the difference, especially noticeable over long distances, and easy to calculate mathematically.

If you have a building at 1000m. When viewed from a distance with 10x binoculars, it looks as big as with the naked eye at 100m. In 8x binoculars it would be 125m. removed.
Everyone has to assess for themselves whether this gain in reach is sufficient.

The disadvantage is that 10x binoculars wobble significantly more and the actual range gain can no longer be exploited here, most things that can be seen with 10x can also be identified with 8x.

You should try it yourself, whether the 10x really bring a profit you can only find out for yourself in the end.

Andreas

Thanks for the feedback Andreas. The main reason I was thinking of 10x30 rather than 10x25 is that most of my walks are very early morning with low light levels. I was assuming that it is worth going for the additional light levels of a 30mm ocular lens. That said, I was impressed with the light gathering levels of the 10x30 binoculars I have tried so far. They are more expensive than my current ones, but I also think technology has moved forward over the past 15 years

 

[Conndomat]

James, I don't think that's the difference between a 2.5mm. and 3mm. EP. is really big, a little at best.
I have tested many binoculars of different sizes with each other in the twilight, with the same transmission and optical performance there is a noticeable gain in brightness at around 1mm. bigger EP.

Most of the time I only use binoculars with an EP. of 5mm. or bigger, I'm not that big of a fan of pocket binoculars, but recently I went through the new Zeiss Pocket (8 / 10x25) and both glasses performed really well, if you are on the road a lot and looking for a small glass, something like that would be recommended.
But there are certainly also very good 10x30 binoculars that meet these criteria.

Andreas

 

[Mark9473]

I don't think that's the difference between a 2.5mm. and 3mm. EP. is really big, a little at best.

It still makes for a 44% brighter view in twilight, assuming equal transmission.

 

[Conndomat]

It still makes for a 44% brighter view in twilight, assuming equal transmission.

Have you compared both formats and a noticeable gain in brightness with the 3mm. EP. established?

Andreas

 

[gweller]

I have owned and extensively used a Leica 10x25 Ultravid, and now have the Zeiss 10x32 SF. The difference between the 2.5mm exit pupil diameter of the Ultravid and the 3.2mm EP of the Zeiss is to me anyway, very evident. The is particularly so in poor light and in dawn and dusk – the so called “twilight” factors are very different between the two, namely 6,25 vs 10,24.

Additionally, I find the Zeiss far easier to hold still and to have less critical eye placement probably due to the greater area for the exit pupil and extra “heft” that helps to eliminate shake.

Coming back to your original question, I think you will definitely notice the difference between 8x and 10x, but of course the trade off is that the image will be less bright.

I would try out as many 10x30/32’s as you can – it’s sometimes a very personal choice as to what model suits you best. Before buying the Zeiss I tried out the Leica Ultravid 10x32, which was also quite nice but for me, the Zeiss really on a next level in terms of ease of use and image quality. If weight is critical I would definitely take a look at the Swaro 10x30 CL. I have the 8x30 CL and it is a very nice binocular.

 

[JamesMorgan]

Update:

Thought it would be useful to post an update on what I eventually decided. I tried many more sets of binoculars, including x25 and x40 objective lenses, with prices ranging from around £100 to just over £1000. Decided my own personal sweet spot was x30 as a balance between weight and light gathering. My final shortlist was Hawke Frontier ED X 10x32, Opticron Traveller BGA ED 10x32 and Bresser Pirsch ED 10x34. Optically I struggled to tell the difference between these three and to be honest to see a difference between these three and much more expensive lenses (could be my old decrepit eyes!). The Hawke was rejected due to weight (around 550g, the other two were around 450g). The Bresser had a 2 hinge open design which I preferred to the Opticron for ease of holding so I went for the Bresser.

I have now tried them in the field in various light conditions and very pleased with them. Somewhat suprising to me is that they seem brighter in low light than my current 8x40's. This may be because of the improved ED glass. They certainly have more vibrant colours which gives the impression of a brighter image. I am finding the 10x magnification does make a significant difference for bird id of waders, especially birds in flight. With my 8x binoculars, I wouldn't normally try to id birds I couldn't see with the naked eye. With the 10x, I am routinely finding and identifying birds that I can't make out at all with the naked eye. They also provides a more pleasing larger image of nearby birds in bushes/trees. My first bird seen with them was a redwing, which led to a verbal 'wow'!

My initial plan was to carry them in my jacket pocket. Whilst this is still an option as they are small enough to fit, I am finding it more useful to carry them in the carry case supplied. This comes with a long shoulder strap so hangs around my hip where my jacket pocket is, but find it is slightly easier to get them in and out of the carry case than my pocket.

My only slight 'disappointment' was that I bought them intending them to complement my current binoculars. However, I am finding them better in every way so can't see me taking out my old binoculars again so they are likely to be relegated to my study set for watching garden birds.

 

[Dennis Mau]

I have had a lot of different 10x30 and 10x32 binoculars, and they can be a very nice format and offer quite a magnification advantage over an 8x binocular while still being lighter and more compact than say a 10x42. I have found though you have to get a higher quality 10x32 because it seems the format is difficult to produce and must be made to exacting tolerances, and you probably won't be satisfied with the performance of a low or even mid-range model. The best 10x32 I have found is the Zeiss 10x32 SF overall. I would avoid the Swarovski EL 10x32 as I found it to have a lot of glare in certain situations.

 

[Mark9473]

It still makes for a 44% brighter view in twilight, assuming equal transmission.

Have you compared both formats and a noticeable gain in brightness with the 3mm. EP. established?

Andreas

Hi Andreas, sorry, I had missed your question.

I find a significant difference in brightness going from 8x20 to 8x25, and another noticeable step to 10x42. Of course when I wrote 44% brighter (3mm EP vs 2.5mm EP) that was not a brightness measurement or impression, it's just the ratio in the areas of the exit pupils, i.e. the calculated brightness ratio.

For use in deepening twilight or at night, I personally feel that 3.5 mm exit pupil is the threshold above which the view becomes enjoyable.

 

[Conndomat]

Hi Andreas, sorry, I had missed your question.

I find a significant difference in brightness going from 8x20 to 8x25, and another noticeable step to 10x42. Of course when I wrote 44% brighter (3mm EP vs 2.5mm EP) that was not a brightness measurement or impression, it's just the ratio in the areas of the exit pupils, i.e. the calculated brightness ratio.

For use in deepening twilight or at night, I personally feel that 3.5 mm exit pupil is the threshold above which the view becomes enjoyable.

Thank you Mark...

Andreas

 

[dries1]

Careful with all this small EP talk, ECP M42 might stop by.