Great Bustard re-introduction in UK (1 Viewer)

[Wells-man]

I know the purists won't count this as 'proper' bird-watching as they aren't on the official British list, but .....

Recently went to visit the Gt Bustard re-introduction project on Salisbury plain. Can recommend this to anyone within reasonable travelling distance
http://greatbustard.org/visit/visit-the-release-site/ The exact location is of course kept secret , and is anyway on private land surrounded by military ranges! So you have to go with the project team.

The project brings over chicks (which would not otherwise have survived) from Russia, and releases them on the plain. Some birds have now bred for, I think, the last 2 years.

They tend to stay around near the release site, because it is ideal habitat for them, but they are free to fly anywhere and some older birds do travel quite far apparently, but so far have returned close to the site for the breeding season.

We spent a sodden morning, initially staring from the hide at the large, empty 'pen'. (It is fenced to keep out foxes etc, but has no roof.) But we were then driven to a nearby field, from where we could see 3 birds across the valley at reasonable 'scope distance. They are far from tame but are not as frightened by a land rover as by people, so we stood the other side of the rover, using it as a hide of sorts... but definitely not a weatherproof one! It poured!

How do people feel about this project? The director seems to have given much of his life to it! I wonder how long it will be before Bustards are officially recognised as a British bird again.

K.

 

[Alexjh1]

In my mind it can only be a good thing if bustards re-establish themselves, not only will it be restoring a natural species to this country, but it'll also be an extra population of a species which if I understand correctly is threatened, at least in europe?

My only concern is whether the population will manage to become large enough to be self sufficient, and ever spread beyond their current range. But to some degree those are only questions that can be answered by trying.

 

[Mysticete]

Wasn't there a recent thread in conservation about pros and cons of Great Bustard reintroduction.

Would love to see one some day, but I do wonder if there is enough habitat for a sustainable population to develop

 

[captaincarot]

Wasn't there a recent thread in conservation about pros and cons of Great Bustard reintroduction.

Would love to see one some day, but I do wonder if there is enough habitat for a sustainable population to develop

i may be wrong but aren't they actually nesting in arable fields? rather than where they were expected to

if so we're not exactly short on supplies of those

 

[Wells-man]

i may be wrong but aren't they actually nesting in arable fields? rather than where they were expected to

if so we're not exactly short on supplies of those

According to the bloke at the project, arable land is totally suitable for them. They even like oilseed rape! He says it's a myth that they need vast ranges of open 'steppe'. However they don't like to fly much if they can help it (they are Europe's [the world's?] heaviest flying bird). So they do better where there are few fences.

Salisbury Plain has vast areas of open grasssland and arable land that is ideal habitat for bustards. Their main problem is predation.

K.

 

[Barred Wobbler]

If they don't like fences (and I'm sure they don't) then England seems to be a less than optimal location.

 

[Himalaya]

According to BBC Springwatch 4 birds nested this year but I heard only 1 chick survived. Does any one know what happened to last year and this years chicks?

I am all for the project as Bustards are under threat. Not only that but they are a remarkable bird and it deserves to be a part of Britain again. We would be lucky to have it.

How long will it be before they are on the Britsh list?

Does anyone know where they spend the winter? Do they stay on Salisbury plain or move around?

Any idea if other areas of the South ie Norfolk, Suffolk esp around the Brecks would be suitable?

How many Bustards are there wandering in Britain now?

 

[Fozzybear]

If they can reintroduce successfully without degrading the Russian population then it seems a really good idea. Must have been really good to see them. :t:

Am curious... why would it not be proper bird-watching?

 

[Trapper64]

I'm afraid it appears despite 'the right to roam', after years of legislative debate, more and more habitat is being taken over by worthwhile 'enviornment projects' with restricted access. OK for us to see but not for you 'unworthy'. (the list is endless and RSPB greatest culprit... we'll buy all the land and you can watch from where we allow you only, rest of the time KEEP OUT). The UK now looks like an open air zoo... wthout any visitors... but is that true of the whole of the UK.... red kites, beaver... wolves... and so on? If you want to see a Bustard, why not go to Russia? What are we going to reintroduce next? Greenfinch? Priorities?

 

[Pete Mella]

Am curious... why would it not be proper bird-watching?

Because until they have a self-sustaining population they're not considered "tickable". The argument would be as long as there's just a few wandering around from a release scheme, that are still reliant on humans for their continued survival, you're not really watching wild birds. Obviously still nice birds to go and have a peek at, though.

 

[jurek]

I think Americans (ABA) say that when reintroduced birds breed, young are already "tickable".

Interesting, there seems to be a difference between British about it.

 

[njlarsen]

I think Americans (ABA) say that when reintroduced birds breed, young are already "tickable".

Interesting, there seems to be a difference between British about it.

I think the rules in the US have changed, there was a discussion of the California rules for recognizing a population on another thread recently. See post 83 in http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=176988

Niels

 

[Fozzybear]

Because until they have a self-sustaining population they're not considered "tickable". The argument would be as long as there's just a few wandering around from a release scheme, that are still reliant on humans for their continued survival, you're not really watching wild birds. Obviously still nice birds to go and have a peek at, though.

Ahh... I did wonder if it might be something to do with that - thanks for the explanation Pete. :t:

 

[jurek]

I think the rules in the US have changed, there was a discussion of the California rules for recognizing a population on another thread recently. See post 83 in http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=176988

Niels

I think this applies only to introduced (non-native) species like parrots and such. Native birds have better... anyway thanks.

 

[Mysticete]

I believe this applies to all introduced and reintroduced birds. Reintroduced Aplomado Falcon and California Condor have both produced young, but are still not considered countable. It took quite a while in some states for the much more successful Trumpeter Swans to be considered countable as well

 

[neilyb]

I am all for re-introducing wildlife, but is there any point? We keep building industrial estates, superstores, offices and houses...how long will re-introduced species (and all the others) actually last? Soon the only free space available to wildlife will be covering an area the size of a zoo, we suck.

 

[Himalaya]

If i spotted the Great Bustards near the release pens I would not consider myself as having seen wild Great Bustards.

However, if I was to take a walk or go for a wander or drive away from the release pen and saw a Bustard I would consider myself as having seen a wild Bustard. If I came across a Bustard away from Salisbury then I would consider myself as having seen a Bustard.

Being dependent upon humans does not make them wild indepenet birds.

 

[John P]

I am all for re-introducing wildlife, but is there any point?

It would be somewhat ironic if humanity eventually got it right and there was nothing left to get it right for.

 

[neilyb]

It would be somewhat ironic if humanity eventually got it right and there was nothing left to get it right for.

Call me a sceptic, but we won't. :-C

 

[Mark Newsome]

Because until they have a self-sustaining population they're not considered "tickable". The argument would be as long as there's just a few wandering around from a release scheme, that are still reliant on humans for their continued survival, you're not really watching wild birds. Obviously still nice birds to go and have a peek at, though.

I've always found arguments for/against 'ticking' birds like these difficult to understand. Take the White-tailed Eagle reintroduction; so if 'first generation releases' are not countable, what do you do about a W-t Eagle that lives for 25-30 years and raises young? Can you not count the original bird as it was not raised in the wild? Are the eagles only countable when you can see the wing tag code and find out if it was a wild-fledged juv and not a first generation reintroduction. Same with the Red Kites we have in the north-east - will I have to check through all the Kites I see until I find a wing-tag from a wild-bred bird? All nonsense really - like you say, all very nice birds and enjoy them for what they are and not for being a tick on a list.

I can see Great Bustards are different to W-t Eagles/Kites - they are not self supporting at present and without further human intervention, its likely they'll disappear. If you're into listing, the difficult bit is where do you draw the line.

Himalaya - so it depends how far you drive from Salisbury Plain as to how tickable the bird are? If its within half a mile of the release pen you don't 'count it as wild', but if the same bird flies another couple of miles away, you do?! Strange way of thinking!

Mark