• Welcome to BirdForum, the internet's largest birding community with thousands of members from all over the world. The forums are dedicated to wild birds, birding, binoculars and equipment and all that goes with it.

    Please register for an account to take part in the discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.
Where premium quality meets exceptional value. ZEISS Conquest HDX.

Is this a Long-billed Pipit? Sudan (1 Viewer)

tomjenner

tomjenner

Well-known member
I took these photos back in May in the Red Sea Hills of north-eastern Sudan. I think they are Long-billed Pipits by I would welcome some confirmation. There were three individuals present and I think two of them are in these photos. Any comments appreciated.
Thanks

Tom
 

Attachments

  • Long-billed Pipit 2.jpg
    Long-billed Pipit 2.jpg
    57.4 KB · Views: 129
  • Long-billed Pipit 1.jpg
    Long-billed Pipit 1.jpg
    54.2 KB · Views: 73
  • Long-billed Pipit 3.jpg
    Long-billed Pipit 3.jpg
    86.7 KB · Views: 124
Hi Tom,

Yes they are Long-billed pipits, apparently juveniles. I don't know what are the others species present in the area but, for example, Grassland (=african) Pipit can be ruled out by the relatively short and curved hindclaw, faint breast streakings, pinkish base to lower mandibule and face pattern.
 
Thanks Tib78. The other expected pipits in the area are mainly Palearctic ones, but you can never rule out anything in this part of the world.

Tom
 
Tom,

I have been looking at the last entries of your blog. Very interesting as usual, it's must be something to bird in such remote and unexplored areas.

I'd like to correct an ID, if I may, this bird: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-v5bm4qskS...AASY/ExNTpV3LK24/s1600/Lesser+Grey+Shrike.jpg isn't a Lesser Grey Shrike but a Southern Grey Shrike.
Lesser Grey has a shorter tail, longer wings (PP), a shorter and more conical bill, a completely black forehead and a pink wash to the underparts: http://www.gregmonkiewicz.com/fotka.php?id_foto=763

Do you have more images of this bird: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-hVgY1n6Lb0E/Tlfz9Me1_zI/AAAAAAAAASE/9oC1_HULF6A/s1600/Honey+Buzzard.jpg ?
 
Tib78 said:
Tom,

I have been looking at the last entries of your blog. Very interesting as usual, it's must be something to bird in such remote and unexplored areas.

I'd like to correct an ID, if I may, this bird: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-v5bm4qskS...AASY/ExNTpV3LK24/s1600/Lesser+Grey+Shrike.jpg isn't a Lesser Grey Shrike but a Southern Grey Shrike.
Lesser Grey has a shorter tail, longer wings (PP), a shorter and more conical bill, a completely black forehead and a pink wash to the underparts: http://www.gregmonkiewicz.com/fotka.php?id_foto=763

Do you have more images of this bird: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-hVgY1n6Lb0E/Tlfz9Me1_zI/AAAAAAAAASE/9oC1_HULF6A/s1600/Honey+Buzzard.jpg ?
Click to expand...

Agreed.
 
Thanks. I was basing my ID on the black meeting over the eye, the all dark bill and the relative lack of white edges to the wing coverts. However, I still need to get my head round the ID of these former forms of Great Grey and I don't doubt that you are correct and I will change it on my blog. The shrike I labeled on my blog as Lesser Grey is very different to the bird in the photo above it, which I had previously considered to be a typical Southern Grey. Is there an age difference between these two birds?
I have added some extra photos of the raptor. My ID was based on the long neck and tail pattern, but I can see that it looks a bit odd for Honey Buzzard. I haven't had any books available since taking these photos (I am still unpacking after a three month vacation and a change of house), so I am limited in what I can research. I look forward to seeing your comments on this bird.

Tom
 

Attachments

  • Buzzard 1.jpg
    Buzzard 1.jpg
    8.6 KB · Views: 50
  • Buzzard 2.jpg
    Buzzard 2.jpg
    12.2 KB · Views: 55
  • Buzzard 3.jpg
    Buzzard 3.jpg
    10 KB · Views: 55
  • Buzzard 4.jpg
    Buzzard 4.jpg
    12.7 KB · Views: 40
Last edited:
Interesting. The African Bird Club list mentions only Egypt and Gabon, so this could be a very good record. I would welcome any further ID comments from those familiar with the species.

Tom
 
Motmot said:
6 fingers make it look as an Oriental Honey Buzzard
Click to expand...

Parker said:
Plus the lack of a black carpal patch, OHB for me also.
Click to expand...

Yes, exactly why I asked for some more images. I was thinking to the possibility of OHB.
But I remain unsure that this is indeed an OHB.

From what I have read and seen OHB is broader winged than EHB, Tom's bird does not look that broad winged to me. But this isn't always easy to judge with images tha. For example this juv OHB looks pretty similar to the subject bird in many aspects:http://www.hawar-islands.com/blog/14_stub.php/2009/01/

Regarding wing formula, 6 fingered primaries are supposedly diagnostic of OHB, but have look at these photos:
Here is a juvenile EHB showing 6 fingers (or 5 and a half...): http://www.pbase.com/johanstenlund/image/117309899
Female EHB showing 6 fingers: http://www.pbase.com/johanstenlund/image/117309906
Juvenile EHB lacking black carpals: http://www.pbase.com/johanstenlund/image/117309889

I am also wondering about the age of the subject bird, it seems to be moulting its inner primaries, I see no obvious trailing edge...2cy?

Perhaps someone with more knowledge of this pair will be able to comment further.
 
Thanks for all your valuable comments so far. I think its worth posting these in a thread of their own, so that more people with knowledge of these species can comment.

Tom
 
tomjenner said:
Thanks. I was basing my ID on the black meeting over the eye, the all dark bill and the relative lack of white edges to the wing coverts.
Click to expand...

Tom, my understanding is that bill colour can be quite variable in the excubitor/meridionalis complex, even among adult birds. For example, a pale bill was believed to be a good pointer for Saxaul Grey Shrike Lanius (e./m.) pallidirostris, but it has been proven that an all black bill wasn't too unusual for this taxon. I don't know to what extent it applies to african taxa.

On the other hand, juveniles birds always show a pinkish bill (at least the lower mandible)


tomjenner said:
The shrike I labeled on my blog as Lesser Grey is very different to the bird in the photo above it, which I had previously considered to be a typical Southern Grey. Is there an age difference between these two birds?
Click to expand...

This Southern Grey: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-v5bm4qskS...AASY/ExNTpV3LK24/s1600/Lesser+Grey+Shrike.jpg is an adult.

And actually, this bird labelled Southern grey:http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-D_YCAqEPA...S0/e1xGa90i-wU/s1600/Southern+Grey+Shrike.jpg looks a lot like a 1st winter Lesser Grey!
 
Warning! This thread is more than 14 years ago old.
It's likely that no further discussion is required, in which case we recommend starting a new thread. If however you feel your response is required you can still do so.

Similar threads

J
Tree or Meadow Pipit?
Replies
6
Views
930
JayFeatherPL
J
T
Tree Pipit OR Meadow Pipit - Isle of Wight, England
2
Replies
32
Views
3K
Southern Viking
Southern Viking
B
Wader id help, Baghdad, December 18
Replies
2
Views
530
bhutjoe
B
F
Terrible Tanzania Photos
Replies
4
Views
481
Derbyfella
D
Georgebirds
Help with Pipits - UK
Replies
11
Views
2K
01101001
01101001

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 2 (members: 0, guests: 2)
Back
Top