Product Review: Nikon E II 8 x 30. (1 Viewer)

[brocknroller]

Hello again,

I’d like to report the results of two more experiments.

It occurred to me that a small binocular like the E II 8 x 30 being stored in a water and airtight Tupperware container with desiccant at room temperature will allow efficient diffusion of gases. The container has 20 sachets each containing 10g of activated silica gel. That ought to create a strong concentration gradient for the net diffusion of a small molecule like water vapour (molecular weight 18 which is considerably smaller than the average molecular weight of air) out of the inside of the binocular. Such a long-term storage strategy ought to thoroughly dehydrate the air in the interior of the instrument. And if that were true, I reasoned, it wouldn’t matter if I treated the binocular like any waterproof, nitrogen-gas-filled roof prism instrument. It should not fog up internally under any conditions so long as I kept to this storage routine.



I can now disclose the result of two further experiments. At five to midnight on Christmas day, I ventured outside with the EII 8 x 30. Temperature +2C, 75% humidity. The sky was clear and I enjoyed 45 minutes of stargazing wearing only light gloves. But instead of returning the instrument to the Tupperware container at the same temperature as the ambient outside air, I just brought it straight inside the house(temperature +20C) like I do with my water and fogproof roofs. The chassis quickly became covered in water as the cold metal encountered the warm inside air. The outer lenses fogged up, as I expected, but after a few minutes, I could see that the interior of the binocular did not fog up. Once it was dried down and left to further air dry, the inside remained crystal clear; no internal fogging observed! I then returned the instrument to its Tupperware container.

In a further experiment conducted on Boxing Day, I ventured out for a two hour glassing session. Temperature +3, 85 per cent humidity. This time I did not wear gloves (I did miss them however as the magnesium alloy chassis really gets cold fast). Time 12:00-14:00. Once again, I brought the instrument straight into my living room(temperature +21C) and watched what happened: once again, the chassis rapidly became drenched with condensed water, and the outer lenses fogged up. But after some of the water evaporated away, I could see that the inside of the instrument was crystal clear, with no signs of fogging. Once all the water had dispersed from the outer lenses, the instrument showed no fogging internally!



Conclusion: Storing the Nikon E II 8x 30 in this desiccant laden Tupperware container prevents internal fogging. Because the air is dry inside the instrument it should not fog up in any realistic situation I will encounter. No need to acclimatise the Tupperware container either. I can use it in much the same way as a modern roof prism binocular.


Yeeeehaaaw!

DD,

Thanks for sharing that. Wish I knew about this years ago! After I used my porros in the cold (except Fuji FMTs, which are sealed), I would rack in the EPs all the way, and then put the porros down the cellar, which wasn't heated, but it a bit warmer than outside, and leave them there overnight. The next day I'd put them in the closet near the front door, which wasn't as warm as the rest of the house. They never fogged but it was tedious. This method is a lot easier.

Do you rack the EPs all the way out before putting the E2 in the Tupperware?

Brock

 

[Dipperdapper]

Hi Brock,

That's a good question. The answer is no, I don't rack the focuser all the way down, so as to ensure that as much gas transfer can occur between the inside and outside of the chassis.

I've done it now with all of my Nikons: the Action I 7x 35(recently acclimated), the EII 8x 30 and the 10x 35 E. They all come straight into room temperature after long walks in single digit or near freezing conditions and don't fog up internally.

It's been a godsend!

Regards,

Neil.

 

[brocknroller]

Hi Brock,

That's a good question. The answer is no, I don't rack the focuser all the way down, so as to ensure that as much gas transfer can occur between the inside and outside of the chassis.

I've done it now with all of my Nikons: the Action I 7x 35(recently acclimated), the EII 8x 30 and the 10x 35 E. They all come straight into room temperature after long walks in single digit or near freezing conditions and don't fog up internally.

It's been a godsend!

Regards,

Neil.

It sounds great, however, in case it doesn't work, finding another 8x32 SE in excellent condition would be difficult. So, I'm reluctant, and I gave my 7x35 Action (Aculon) to my friend's daughter, and my 8x30 E2s are the 100th Anniversary Edition, so they are also irreplaceable. Somewhere, I have an old Nikon 7x35 WF that would work well for the Great Porro Fogproofing Experiment. First, I have to find them. I moved last year and a lot of stuff got lost or misplaced. But I did use it here last year, so it's around somewhere.

Tomorrow would be a good day to try it out since the high temps are going to be in the teens, but I don't have enough desiccant. I save the packets when I get packages with them, but they may be too old. I will order some from Chinazon.

Thanks again for the tip!

Brock

 

[Dipperdapper]

Dear Brock,

You’re most welcome!


I thought I’d conduct another experiment this evening while I was attending to my students.


The question remains as to how long it takes a binocular to dry out on the inside upon commencement of the desiccant Tupperware method. I acquired the Nikon Action 7x 35 on the afternoon of January 21 last and immediately began storing it in the container as previously described( at room temperature) from that date, opening it several times during that time to access the instrument for a bout of glassing, but always returning it to its container afterwards. That is 12 days in total.

Tonight I took the instrument outside and placed it in my open greenhouse, ambient temperature +8C, humidity 75% at 6.30pm local time and brought it back into the inside of my home at 9.30pm local time, so three hours of exposure.

As expected, the instrument immediately became covered with condensation after hitting the warm indoor air at 20C as the pictures below show:







15 minutes later much of the condensation had dispersed from the outside of the lenses but I also took some photos of the interior of the instrument at the same time. You can see that it remained entirely fog free.








So I can say with confidence that 12 days of storing the instrument in this way was long enough to render it dry internally. I would probably recommend a period of 7-10 days for starters if you intend using your instruments in the same way as one would treat a waterproof & N2-purged roof prism binocular.




I love to use my non-waterproof Porros regularly, so you might say, necessity was the mother of invention!


Hope that helps.



Kind Regards,



Neil

 

[Dipperdapper]

One further experiment to do: gonna have to sacrifice my junk Visionary Porros to the dew gods. Will serve as a control against my Nikon Action 7x 35. Similar dimensions........

More anon.

 

[brocknroller]

Dear Brock,



Many thanks for your feedback and my apologies for not responding sooner. I’ve been nursing the mother of all head colds that’s pretty much knocked me for six for over a week now.

I sense a real kindred spirit in you regarding Porro prism binoculars. My little Nikon E II 8 x 30 remains my favourite binocular. Just like the proofs of a mathematical theorem, the sheer, elegant simplicity of a well-executed Porro prism design greatly appeals to my mind.

The little EII is still a world class instrument, even when one considers 21st century roof prism models. And while top roofs may edge the Nikon E II out, the improvements are at best, subtle. The views through the E II are uniquely immersive, what with its enormous and well corrected field of view and that marvellous 3D impression no roof prism binocular can reproduce. Ergonomically, I’ve yet to hold an instrument that fits my hands as well as the E II. Its buttery smooth focus wheel is ideal for birding and my particular instrument can focus down to 1.97m.


I think the lack of waterproofing on the EII is rather overstated. We’ve become such a timorous bunch haven’t we? I mean, you’d be forgiven for garnering the impression birding only began when waterproof binoculars were invented. What did folk do for decades before the advent of the nitrogen purged and o ring sealed instruments? They just got on with it! And there’s a sizeable body of literature out there that proves my point!

If I’m out on a walk and the heavens begin to open, I just stick the little 8 x 30 in my coat pocket. As I said elsewhere, I don’t glass in wet weather as the visibility is poor, and no binocular – even one with glass mined from the asteroid belt – can change that. So far I’ve found that storing my desiccant-filled Tupperware case in a dry, unheated outdoor shed solves the internal fogging issue.

And if per chance it does fog up one day: no big deal – I’ll just dry it out in a warm airing cupboard and get on with it.


I’m envious of your collection of classic Porros. I’m not a collector myself. In my world, if it isn’t getting used it gets shifted and I just wouldn’t be able to find the time to enjoy them all. That’s why I stick to a small number – a handful really – of binoculars for personal use, to cover all my daylight and night time excursions; and these include roofs and Porro prism models.



With best wishes,



Neil.

Thanks Neil for your comments on the 8x30 E2 for being a fellow porro lover. I hope that will be the last "mother of all head colds" you will have this winter, which here in PA has been rather mild (aside from the Christmas Bomb Cyclone). The mild winter has allowed me to do a lot more hiking and birding than I usually do at this time of year.

Brock

 

[Dipperdapper]

Hi Brock,

That head cold lasted for two whole weeks; never experienced anything like that in living memory. Loads of folk got it the same way ; long-lasting and hard. I'm sure it was lockdown related.

Anyways, I performed two further experiments; one last night for two hours at 9C, 95% humidity and another this afternoon for 3.25 hours at 10C, 86% humidity. Both binoculars - Nikon Action 7x 35 and Visionary 8x 40 - were subjected to the same treatment and brought straight into a warm 20-21C living room and left to sit for 20 minutes before I took shots of their interiors.





I got the same result in both cases but it was more pronounced in the case of the longer exposure.

The Visionary 8x 40 had condensation on the prisms:


The Nikon Action 7x 35 did not:


So I think that wraps things up for me at least.

Keeping them in their desiccant-filled Tupperware containers allows me to access them easily and quickly without having to faff about prizing them out of tight-fitting cases and removing their covers etc. They're just ready to go.

The desiccant will also prevent any fungal growth in the long term.

I've got through half the winter perfectly fine doing this, so I don't anticipate any hiccups for the remainder.

With best wishes,

Neil.

 

[Scott98]

I'm always perplexed by these worries about condensation, maybe from a lifetime of using refractors and astronomy gear, with none of it being sealed or waterproofed? My usual method seems to work OK so far - bring the case outside with you. Put the optics back in the case before coming inside. Don't bring the optics out of the case until it warms up. It's worked for telescopes and it seems to work on my new/old 7x35 E's as well.

I found an excellent, USA-made case from a company in upstate New York that fits the 7x35 E's perfectly, and would also fit the 8x30's and 10x35's. the first one has a shoulder strap with plastic hooks that are detachable - the "D" version has metal D-rings holding the shoulder strap that cannot be removed - it's also available with no strap and belt loops instead. It might have better insulation that the OEM case and it zips closed - the padding and nylon functions as a insulating cooler that slows down temperature change - also FWIW I prefer the cordura to the packcloth:

PADDED POUCH

Specifications: Dimensions: 5.5"h x 7"w x 2" dWeight: 6 oz Features: • A compact, single pocket case designed to protect your most delicate gear• Fully padded on all sides, to safeguard camera, tools, or other breakables• Flap top secures with large Velcro patch• Available in three styles: belt...

toughtraveler.com

PADDED POUCH D

Specifications: Dimensions: 5.5"h x 7"w x 2" dWeight: 6 oz Features:• A compact, single pocket case designed to protect your most delicate gear• Fully padded on all sides, to safeguard camera, tools, or other breakables• Flap top secures with large Velcro patch• 1.5” wide, long shoulder strap•...

toughtraveler.com

 

[Dipperdapper]

Btw: The Nikon Action featured in these last few posts is not to be be confused with the current line of Nikon Aculon and Action EX 7x 35s.

It's in a completely different league optically & ergonomically to anything they currently produce, a real gem in fact.

Full story here:

The Nikon Action Mark 1 7 x 35 Widefield: A Very Lucky Find!

Evening all, I serendipitously came across this old Nikon Action Mark 1 7x 35 Widefield 9.3 degree field, circa mid-1980s in superb condition. Needless to say, I'm very impressed! Link attached below...

www.birdforum.net

 

[jafritten]

I think the Nikons would make great hiking bins, if it wasn't for them hanging on one's chest in the way they do. I used them on a 7 hour hike last Sunday and carrying them was less than enjoyable.

I know, I know, quoting oneself is frowned upon by many... Maybe my latest invention will win your approval. The Nikons now hang straight. The rubber bands are cut from tethered objective lens covers. Needs to be tested out thoroughly. If things don't stay in place, I'll try and thread some lace through the strap lugs.

 

[[email protected]]

Hi Brock,

That head cold lasted for two whole weeks; never experienced anything like that in living memory. Loads of folk got it the same way ; long-lasting and hard. I'm sure it was lockdown related.

Anyways, I performed two further experiments; one last night for two hours at 9C, 95% humidity and another this afternoon for 3.25 hours at 10C, 86% humidity. Both binoculars - Nikon Action 7x 35 and Visionary 8x 40 - were subjected to the same treatment and brought straight into a warm 20-21C living room and left to sit for 20 minutes before I took shots of their interiors.
View attachment 1492594




I got the same result in both cases but it was more pronounced in the case of the longer exposure.

The Visionary 8x 40 had condensation on the prisms:
View attachment 1492592

The Nikon Action 7x 35 did not:
View attachment 1492593

So I think that wraps things up for me at least.

Keeping them in their desiccant-filled Tupperware containers allows me to access them easily and quickly without having to faff about prizing them out of tight-fitting cases and removing their covers etc. They're just ready to go.

The desiccant will also prevent any fungal growth in the long term.

I've got through half the winter perfectly fine doing this, so I don't anticipate any hiccups for the remainder.

With best wishes,

Neil.

One other problem besides condensate with the unsealed Nikon E2 8x30 is the "Accordion Effect." When you rack your focuser back and forth on the E2, it acts like an accordion and sucks dust inside the binocular. Every older E2 I have seen has dust inside, and they need to professionally cleaned to maintain their performance. Another problem with unsealed binoculars.

 

[Paultricounty]

One other problem besides condensate with the unsealed Nikon E2 8x30 is the "Accordion Effect." When you rack your focuser back and forth on the E2, it acts like an accordion and sucks dust inside the binocular. Every older E2 I have seen has dust inside, and they need to professionally cleaned to maintain their performance. Another problem with unsealed binoculars.

That is inherent in most all porro binoculars , and another reason the manufacturers and consumers went the roof prism bino route. Water proof and low maintenance is a large part of the roofs appeal.

 

[[email protected]]

That is inherent in most all porro binoculars , and another reason the manufacturers and consumers went the roof prism bino route. Water proof and low maintenance is a large part of the roofs appeal.

Exactly. It is more difficult to seal and waterproof a porro prism binocular. You end up with a focuser that is way too tight, like the Habicht because of the seals necessary to keep it waterproof.

 

[albie...]

One other problem besides condensate with the unsealed Nikon E2 8x30 is the "Accordion Effect."

Like a bellows ? Maybe once the internals are all covered with dust and useless you can use the E2 to run a church organ .
Nitpicking to the max .

 

[Scott98]

It's OK...I don't allow dust to come anywhere near my binoculars! Problem solved

 

[jhorvat]

The easiest way to make these binoculars hang straight is to make sure that the dust cover is pushed firmly onto the oculars- I hope my impromptu pic illustrates this well enough...

 

[Dipperdapper]

Hello again,

I came across some recent video footage taken with an older 8 x 30 E II created by YouTuber, BlackForestRecon, overlooking some magnificent alpine scenery:

I can only imagine that such landscapes are ideal for the little 8x 30.

Neil.

 

[Mikbul]

The easiest way to make these binoculars hang straight is to make sure that the dust cover is pushed firmly onto the oculars- I hope my impromptu pic illustrates this well enough...

Oversize rain guards (dust cover) suck, get an Opticron rain guard.

https://www.opticronusa.com/our-products/accessories/binocular-rainguards