Vortex Talon HD 32mm class? Yes! (1 Viewer)

[lmans66]

"I think it's all about expectations. If you expect a $400 roof with a 477' FOV to have perfect edges like a Nikon Premier, then you are sure to be disappointed."

I don't remember my Nikon Premier having perfect edges. Do they? I remember quite a bit of CA at the edge and that is what caused me to sell them. I would like to see an EII like view in this new glass but maybe I am dreaming.It's the first Chinese HD WA 8x32 so it should be interesting to see what the Chinese can do for $400.00.

Why do we need 'perfect edges?'.... When looking thru binocs your eyes are centered, more or less. Who... Who.... Looks thru their binocs n focuses from the edges? Sometimes I think we place more value on some features than what is necessary.

I have the talons 10x 42 .... N find the center to be in as much focus as any Nikon I have compared it to....let alone more alpha binos.

I suppose if u wish to focus on the edge.... The more power to you but for me, that equates to a headache... Plain n simple

 

[bh46118]

If 75 0r 80% of the FOV is sharp, then I'm happy. Especially if the FOV is wide. I don't try to look out to the edge of the FOV, for me its there in my peripheral vision for a greater sense of expansiveness. If I want to see something with the binocular, I bring that object into the center. That's just me though.

Why do we need 'perfect edges?'.... When looking thru binocs your eyes are centered, more or less. Who... Who.... Looks thru their binocs n focuses from the edges? Sometimes I think we place more value on some features than what is necessary.

I have the talons 10x 42 .... N find the center to be in as much focus as any Nikon I have compared it to....let alone more alpha binos.

I suppose if u wish to focus on the edge.... The more power to you but for me, that equates to a headache... Plain n simple

 

[Chosun Juan]

Flat field view usage

Why do we need 'perfect edges?'.... When looking thru binocs your eyes are centered, more or less. Who... Who.... Looks thru their binocs n focuses from the edges?

Yes ! Why indeed !

While I can certainly see the benefits (in helping your peripheral vision) of such a wonderful feature, and in fact would choose it / demand it .........

It brings me to a vexing question that I posed on another thread (which everyone thus far has duly dodged !!) ||
http://www.birdforum.net/showpost.php?p=2379096&postcount=7

Just when exactly can you use it ?! And by this I mean moving your gaze to the edge of the field.

When do any sort of blackouts or distortions, other funny stuff (Not 'rolling ball!' - ..... !), become apparent (when moving your gaze off centre - and by how far), and what is the relationship to exit pupil size ?

(for example, I find that a 7mm EP is pretty luxurious, and enables a fair degree of roaming around inside the view to check out the ripples in the rubber field stops say, etc.)
(by ~5mm EP [say ~8x42] I'm finding all sorts of strange things going on with any attempt to even move the gaze much from the centre, let alone roam over to study the edges in detail ?)
(what happens when the EP drops to 4mm, such as a Vortex Talon HD 8x32, or even less, like a Nikon 8x30 EII ?)

Do I even have the slightest clue what I'm raving on about here, and is anyone else in this boat?

Many thanks,


Chosun :gh:

 

[vop]

My experience, even though limited, is that bigger exit pupils gives less problems of all kinds, especially eye placement related. Maybe it also have to do with shorter eye relief?

 

[looksharp65]

My experience, even though limited, is that bigger exit pupils gives less problems of all kinds

Not to mention that less problems of all kinds gives bigger pupils...?
|=\|

 

[bh46118]

I guess I probably do roam the image a tiny bit with the 6.5 Fury.

(for example, I find that a 7mm EP is pretty luxurious, and enables a fair degree of roaming around inside the view to check out the ripples in the rubber field stops say, etc.)



Chosun :gh:

 

[Chosun Juan]

My experience, even though limited, is that bigger exit pupils gives less problems of all kinds, especially eye placement related. Maybe it also have to do with shorter eye relief?

Vop, yes, I think this is heading in the right direction:

A combination of exit pupil size, eye relief distance, and even 'eye relief plane' (i.e. how close the 3D bundle of light gets to a 2D plane [or whatever best corresponds to the shape of your eyeball] at the point of reception) seem to be the factors affecting the blackouts and problems I described.

This exact phenomenon is being discussed over on the Leica short eye relief thread:
http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=224513

We know that one of the trade offs for the 477ft FOV of the Vortex Talon HD 8x32 is the shorter 15.2mm eye relief.

Of the edge quality we can only speculate, until they're in hand.

But one thing I know for sure is that I'm out ! bummer! || since I'm in the 18-20mm ER range.
Otherwise this sounds like a fantastic bit of kit.

Off to the promised land! Chosun :gh:

 

[CarlTN]

Looks like I found this thread just in time. I just joined the forum so I could post here. I too am very interested in the Talon HD 8x32. I'm no expert on binoculars or birds, but I'm enthusiastic! The FOV is interesting to me also. I'm considering trying these, and probably something else in the 42-45mm size, before deciding what to keep. Right now I'm trying the cheaper Bushnell 7x36, which seems great for the low price. I may return it though. The Vanguard Endeavor ED, and the Minox BL, look interesting also.

You guys are trying to figure out what chinese factory is making these. I wonder where they are designed? In China, or America? Sorry if that's too ignorant of me...I guess it must be China...in which case, they should just sell them under the Chinese name and forget all this marketing crap! If Chinese people are designing these, their name should be on it.

 

[looksharp65]

I guess it must be China...in which case, they should just sell them under the Chinese name and forget all this marketing crap! If Chinese people are designing these, their name should be on it.

The REAL reason they don't is that the silver paint wears out from the itsy-bitsy-teenie-weenie dots of the Chinese letters/symbols, causing new and unpredictable meanings. Who would like a binocular named "Frying sausage with beaver lard and cute gravel"...?

 

[looksharp65]

The REAL reason they don't is that the silver paint wears out from the itsy-bitsy-teenie-weenie dots of the Chinese letters/symbols, causing new and unpredictable meanings. Who would like a binocular named "Frying sausage with beaver lard and cute gravel"...?

Realizing I might offend Chinese feelings, I'm the first to admit that even my own language holds some significant little dots and rings, whose presence or absence may turn a sentence into something completely different.

When I was young, Swedish food store chain Konsum (as in consumer, consumption) had an advertising campaign with the motto:

"Välkommen till det glada Konsumgänget!"

meaning "Welcome to the Happy Konsum Team!"

However, a bright joker saw that by putting two dots above the "o", making it an "ö", the meaning of the motto changed significantly:

"Välkommen till det glada Könsumgänget!"

meaning "Welcome to the Happy Sexual Intercourse!"

Even though Sweden used to have a reputation of being excessively sexually emancipated, this reputation was mostly exaggerated and the advertising campaign was withdrawn. :-O

 

[vop]

Realizing I might offend Chinese feelings, I'm the first to admit that even my own language holds some significant little dots and rings, whose presence or absence may turn a sentence into something completely different.

When I was young, Swedish food store chain Konsum (as in consumer, consumption) had an advertising campaign with the motto:

"Välkommen till det glada Konsumgänget!"

meaning "Welcome to the Happy Konsum Team!"

However, a bright joker saw that by putting two dots above the "o", making it an "ö", the meaning of the motto changed significantly:

"Välkommen till det glada Könsumgänget!"

meaning "Welcome to the Happy Sexual Intercourse!"

Even though Sweden used to have a reputation of being excessively sexually emancipated, this reputation was mostly exaggerated and the advertising campaign was withdrawn. :-O

Oh dear...B

 

[brocknroller]

Not to mention that less problems of all kinds gives bigger pupils...?
|=\|

Not all kinds. A bin with large exit pupils used under conditions where your entrance pupils will open up wide enough to accommodate them will bring out the worst in your eyes if you have astigmatism that's not corrected by glasses or Torus lens contacts.

More a problem with stargazing than birding. During the day, your entrance pupils will shrink to ~ 3mm in sunlight, which minimizes the effect of mild to moderate astigmatism.

Brock

 

[looksharp65]

Erm, well, the joke sort of got lost. I just meant that when you're dwelling in great comfort and general feeling of pleasure, your pupils will become larger.

//L

 

[stereotruckdriver]

I'm about to pre-order a pair myself. Curious to hear how they compare to the rock star of the 32mm class, those Sightrons, which are taking the world by storm....

The 477' FOV is sooooo enticing and if they can package the optical quality of the Talon HD / Zen ED3 class into a 32mm, 20oz body I am all in! I love the optics and ergonomics of my 8x43 ED3, and I am now a sucker for the open bridge feel, but they are a bit too bulky and heavy for my tastes. If the Talons can match the optical quality while shaving off an inch of length and 7oz I will be a happy camper.

Eagle Optics said they expect the 32mm Talons to be out early March (so soon!) and the black Ranger ED versions should arrive in May.

So what's the latest on these? Just curious not that i'm going to buy them. I just don't think an 8x32 with that w/fov is very promising? To much wasted on edge distortions, just don't see a gradual fall off? I could be wrong! I think a 420-430 mark would have been a better compromise, i wonder how large the occular lenses are? I would think they will have to be pretty complex ep's to pull that feat off at the $400 mark? Bryce...

 

[ceasar]

477' FOV is a big reach for an 8 x 32 roof prism. Nikon's 8 x 30 E2 porro pulls off 462' but it has fall off at the edges which can be dialed in. It has big prisms too.

Bob

 

[CarlTN]

The latest on these Talon HD's, as far as I know, is that they were supposed to come out the end of March, and yet they still haven't. This was told to me via email by a Vortex representative.

I've already spent beyond my limit on binoculars for the year, so it will be fun to watch all the fanboys go at it, if or when these ever go on sale.

Amongst others, I bought the Vortex Fury 8x32, and I like them a lot, but they aren't perfect. They absolutely blew the Pentax 8x36, and the Bushnell 7x36, out of the water...in my opinion.

Besides the mythical Talon HD 8x32, the other two 8x32's that interest me, are the Kowa BD 8x32, and the Vixen "New" Foresta 8x32 (check out allbinos.com's test of the Vixen, especially its transmission curve...it looks amazingly bright.)

Besides trying several of the "alpha class" in the 42mm size, I admit the Swarovski 8x30 are fantastic...but a bit more than I want to spend. Perhaps the fickle market will decide they need replacing with a new version, and there will be a "sale".

Others have said the Sightron Blue Sky II 8x32 is a great buy...I have yet to try them.

 

[looksharp65]

Amongst others, I bought the Vortex Fury 8x32, and I like them a lot, but they aren't perfect.

If you decide to sell them, please remember me!

 

[FrankD]

Carl,

I have had the Vixen 8x32 and the Sightron 8x32 side by side. Both are impressive binoculars. They have slightly different color renditions/contrast levels but both are more than acceptable for my tastes. I think you would enjoy either. There is a notable difference in price though.

 

[CarlTN]

Frank,

That's very interesting to me, that you have tried both. Did you not find that the Vixen was brighter than the Sightron? I'd be interested in discussing it further, if you'd like to private message me sometime. I wish I had the disposable income to just keep buying and try everything (along with my other hobbies)...but I just don't.

 

[FrankD]

Carl,

Here is the link to the specific page of the Sightron thread where I did the comparisons between the Sightron, the Vixen and the Kenko bins. Start with post 31. Pics included. Feel free to PM me if you want to discuss it further.

http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=211793&page=2

For what it is worth, and based on my experiences with these models and some other similar ones, dielectric coatings on the prisms don't necessarily have the impact that one might think. Increased measured brightness might be there but since it is so tied in with other areas such as contrast then I feel it is more of the specific combination of coatings that has a more profound impact on perceived brightness more so than the specific type of prism coating itself.

Also, and for what it is worth, I am in the same boat as you now. The disposable income benefit is a thing of the past. I doubt I will be buying and trying anything in the near future.