Premium (Alpha) vs Image stabilized (1 Viewer)

[kimmik]

I am really unhappy with the 3 years warranty for the Canon IS. But, on the other hand, I have a laptop costing the same amount as the 10x42 IS and I accepted only 3 years warranty without any hesitation.
Hence the question: why differentiate? Canon knows how to manufacture IS.

But there is no 10-year alternative for laptops.

 

[Hermann]

If I were to get a scope, it would have to be handholdable and backpackable. (Had a podmount type scope which i gave away due to lack of use). If it has IS, that would be an instant sell for me!

Interesting. That shows how different we all are. I typically use a scope to scan a flock of birds or the landscape searching for birds for longer periods of time, often for half an hour or more. So a handheld, stabilised scope doesn't work for me, I prefer to have some kind of support, either a tripod or at least a monopod. That's why the stabilised Zeiss 20x60 S Mono doesn't really work for me, I only use it if I don't expect I need a scope all that much.

Hermann.

 

[kimmik]

Interesting. That shows how different we all are. I typically use a scope to scan a flock of birds or the landscape searching for birds for longer periods of time, often for half an hour or more. So a handheld, stabilised scope doesn't work for me, I prefer to have some kind of support, either a tripod or at least a monopod. That's why the stabilised Zeiss 20x60 S Mono doesn't really work for me, I only use it if I don't expect I need a scope all that much.

Hermann.

Absolutely - i am very curious about your said scope!

List of importance to bring, in my order as i prioritise mobility:

eyes
camera (aka phone)
bigger eyes (aka Binoculars)
Bigger camera

with a hypothetical IS scope, it will be easy to use with phone camera for zoom photos/videos, unlike the awkward but ok binocular photos. Has the potential to replace both bigger camera and … even binos 😱

For some trips 🙃

 

[Conndomat]

I am really unhappy with the 3 years warranty for the Canon IS. But, on the other hand, I have a laptop costing the same amount as the 10x42 IS and I accepted only 3 years warranty without any hesitation.
Hence the question: why differentiate? Canon knows how to manufacture IS.

1. Canon only gives a 2-year guarantee here in Germany...
2. Do I have a laptop that is not nearly as expensive as a 10x42 IS.
3. Have I ever had trouble with an outrageously expensive Canon lens (400mm. 2,8 II) where the IS broke exactly after 2 1/2 years.
4. Was the Canon service just miserable, Canon insisted on unconditional compliance with the warranty period, did not respond to emails in some cases and the repair took more than 3 months, and the front lens was completely dirty (fingerprints) when the lens was returned.
Such behavior shows what the manufacturer thinks of its customers.

You may be able to get 10 IS binoculars that work perfectly and for a long time, but if you're unlucky enough to catch the 11 that has flaws, you're screwed.
I demand from a manufacturer that he also takes care of the customer adequately after the purchase, especially if you have bought a high-priced item, but that doesn't seem to be the case with Canon.

I would still accept a 5 year guarantee on the electronics, 2 years is clearly not enough for me!

Andreas

 

[John A Roberts]

In terms of significantly reducing the bulk of IS binoculars, by chance I just came across this example of a 16x42 marketed by Bresser.
See the details at: Bresser | BRESSER 16x42 STABILIZER OIS binoculars with image stabilizer | Expand Your Horizon




It seems to be a development of a 16x42 model that's currently marketed by Kite:




While both have the objectives located very closely together, the newer version has eliminated the bulk that was to the side of the objectives.
So also a way for other manufacturers to go?


John


p.s. They would seem to be related to another design offered by Opticron in 10x30, 12x30 and 14x30:

 

[kimmik]

<700g! Wow. subscribed.

 

[Paultricounty]

In terms of significantly reducing the bulk of IS binoculars, by chance I just came across this example of a 16x42 marketed by Bresser.
See the details at: Bresser | BRESSER 16x42 STABILIZER OIS binoculars with image stabilizer | Expand Your Horizon

View attachment 1461256


It seems to be a development of a 16x42 model that's currently marketed by Kite:

View attachment 1461261


While both have the objectives located very closely together, the newer version has eliminated the bulk that was to the side of the objectives.
So also a way for other manufacturers to go?


John


p.s. They would seem to be related to another design offered by Opticron in 10x30, 12x30 and 14x30:

View attachment 1461262

I seen this a while back but couldn’t find anybody selling them. Dose anybody know if these ever come to the market. These are very interesting because of weight. And of course the glass, there’s very little in the description from Brussels concerning optics.

Thx

Paul

 

[exup]

There are good reports of the Fujinon TSX stabilised bins too. Similar form factor to these.

 

[Ted Y.]

1. Canon only gives a 2-year guarantee here in Germany...
2. Do I have a laptop that is not nearly as expensive as a 10x42 IS.
3. Have I ever had trouble with an outrageously expensive Canon lens (400mm. 2,8 II) where the IS broke exactly after 2 1/2 years.
4. Was the Canon service just miserable, Canon insisted on unconditional compliance with the warranty period, did not respond to emails in some cases and the repair took more than 3 months, and the front lens was completely dirty (fingerprints) when the lens was returned.
Such behavior shows what the manufacturer thinks of its customers.

You may be able to get 10 IS binoculars that work perfectly and for a long time, but if you're unlucky enough to catch the 11 that has flaws, you're screwed.
I demand from a manufacturer that he also takes care of the customer adequately after the purchase, especially if you have bought a high-priced item, but that doesn't seem to be the case with Canon.

I would still accept a 5 year guarantee on the electronics, 2 years is clearly not enough for me!

Andreas

Point 2: I was not bragging about my laptop, one uses the binocular/laptop one needs

I think the same about the quality of after-sale services.
It is a reality some other manufacturers of IS binoculars offer 1 year or 5 years (from the date of fabrication).
An IS binocular with a long warranty exists on the market and the price is also "longer".

 

[Ted Y.]

But there is no 10-year alternative for laptops.

I agree. Even so, it seems a 3 years warranty for a laptop is good enough, but not for a binocular.

It is because the consumer does not have a choice of 10 years warranty for laptops or because the consumer is over exigent with binoculars?

And is a 30 years warranty what some of us think it is (or expect to be)?

A manufacturer can credit or offer a substitute for the binocular when it cannot be repaired. But what amount after 20 years? (right now the inflation is 8.1%). And what model will be the replacement, what quality and manufactured where? We prefer the 30 years warranty and we pay for it with our $$$ (or another currency). It is not free of charge.

 

[kimmik]

I agree. Even so, it seems a 3 years warranty for a laptop is good enough, but not for a binocular.

It is because the consumer does not have a choice of 10 years warranty for laptops or because the consumer is over exigent with binoculars?

And is a 30 years warranty what some of use think it is (or expect to be)?

A manufacturer can credit or offer a substitute for the binocular when it cannot be repaired. But what amount after 20 years? (right now the inflation is 8.1%). And what model will be the replacement, what quality and manufactured where? We prefer the 30 years warranty and we pay for it with our $$$ (or another currency). It is not free of charge.

Agree. I’m too poor for IS

 

[exup]

<700g! Wow. subscribed.

Just put my 12x36 iii on a scale and 702g including batteries.

 

[Conndomat]

Point 2: I was not bragging about my laptop, one uses the binocular/laptop one needs

I didn't say that either, I just pointed out that there are laptops that are significantly cheaper compared to the price of a Canon 10x42 IS!

I agree. Even so, it seems a 3 years warranty for a laptop is good enough, but not for a binocular.

It is because the consumer does not have a choice of 10 years warranty for laptops or because the consumer is over exigent with binoculars?

It's an individual decision!
I would not buy a laptop or binoculars for around 1500 euros that only have a 2 or 3 year guarantee.

Also, this argument is on shaky ground...

I am really unhappy with the 3 years warranty for the Canon IS. Canon knows how to manufacture IS.

Why are you a bit unhappy with the 3-year guarantee if you are sure that the IS will last much longer anyway, then it doesn't matter whether it's 1, 3 or 5 years?

I have an NAD CD player, the legislature only gives a 2-year guarantee for this, but if you register with NAD you get a 5-year guarantee, why can't Canon also use this principle if they are sure that their products will last longer?
It would certainly encourage some potential buyers to buy a Canon IS and would give the company greater confidence, no manufacturer is forbidden to extend the warranty period.

I'm just not willing to buy an expensive product that only comes with a 2 year warranty anymore, I guess I'm not alone here?!

"In Germany there is a saying: "The clever person learns from his mistakes, the wise person learns from the mistakes of other people..."

Since I will probably never become wise, I would like to at least become clever...

Andreas

 

[kimmik]

Just put my 12x36 iii on a scale and 702g including batteries.

Hmm 750 pounds. It was on my shortlist. went with the CL curio instead (630 pounds)

 

[exup]

went with the CL curio instead (630 pounds)

I didn't know there was a stabilised 12x36 CL curio!

 

[kimmik]

Just following your apple vs pear mate. 16x42.

 

[Paultricounty]

The Fujis are 3 pounds and make noise when using the IS. The Bresslers look like a whole other animal.

 

[Hermann]

The Fujis are 3 pounds and make noise when using the IS. The Bresslers look like a whole other animal.

If the Bresser is similar to or even identical with the Kite, you need to be aware there are pretty mixed reports about, even here. Check the Kite Forum, for instance.

The one Kite 16x42 I had a chance to look through didn't work properly, by the way.

Hermann

 

[Ted Y.]

It's an individual decision!
I would not buy a laptop or binoculars for around 1500 euros that only have a 2 or 3 year guarantee.

Yes indeed it is.

I'm just not willing to buy an expensive product that only comes with a 2 year warranty anymore, I guess I'm not alone here?!

"In Germany there is a saying: "The clever person learns from his mistakes, the wise person learns from the mistakes of other people..."

My rational thinking says you are right all along the line and I agree with you, the risk is big.
My emotional thinking says I can trust the manufacturer.
We all have this two kinds of thinking, right?

Also, this argument is on shaky ground...
Why are you a bit unhappy with the 3-year guarantee if you are sure that the IS will last much longer anyway, then it doesn't matter whether it's 1, 3 or 5 years?

I do not see it as shaky ground.
No, I am not sure the IS will last more, no one can know this for a sample. The data about the reliability is missing, therefore the decision to buy is based on trust and a lot optimism ( and strongly motivated by the vibrations of some binoculars).
A 10x IS offers to me a much better image than a 12x not IS, at the same price.

 

[Conndomat]

My rational thinking says you are right all along the line and I agree with you, the risk is big.
My emotional thinking says I can trust the manufacturer.
We all have this two kinds of thinking, right?

It's just a bit of a lottery game.

By the way, so as not to see everything negatively here, I also believe that most IS in lenses and binoculars from Canon last longer than 5 years, but unfortunately none of us know how high the failure rate is in the first few years.
The vast majority of Canon IS systems that use do not write their experiences in forums, we are a small microcosm of experiences from which no general validity can be derived, but if there were a high percentage of IS failures at Canon, the manufacturer would certainly not have lasted so long.
Therefore, of course, everyone has to decide for themselves how far they accept an early defect and how high the risk is assessed, Canon will not present reliable figures here.

At that time I was extremely disappointed with customer service, for this reason alone I would think twice about buying something from this manufacturer again, for me the service is also important and how the service deals with the customer.

Otherwise yes, IS binoculars can be a great thing...

Andreas