Grey-cheeked or gray-cheeked thrush? (1 Viewer)

[VATH 82]

Grey or Gray...does it matter?

This is just a difference between American and British English. Yelling at people for using one form or another or shouting imperialism when one committee chooses a spelling you disagree with is no different to me than birding in Japan, Germany, or any other country, and getting mad that they refuse to use english language names for birds.

At least the loon vs divers, Jaegar vs Skua debate I can understand, since those are completely different words, and I no birders that do get confused over that. There is absolutely 0 confusion if I use a different spelling of gray/grey in written communication (and none in spoken language!)

I prefer that sentence to read...This is just a difference between English and American English.

 

[chris butterworth]

That must be a regional one, because I have NEVER heard it before, in either the South or California.

Go and ask for a 'fuel tap' for a Harley.

 

[chris butterworth]

Hmmm. Interesting. http://english.stackexchange.com/qu...spelling-supersede-british-spelling-in-the-us

 

[alytothrix]

Most of the species' breeding range is in Canada where the normal spelling is 'grey'. Canadian official sources do seem to stick with the American spelling of 'Gray-cheeked' however (I assume strictly following the AOU).

 

[Xenospiza]

For reasons of consistency with other languages, color beats colour. It isn't a long sound as in four or pour (never mind sour), so the simple "o" gets my wholly objective approval – even if I use the "-our" spelling myself.

 

[Nutcracker]

And on the emotive level, Gray-cheeked thrush sounds like a (slightly) exotic foreign visitor. Grey-cheeked Thrush sounds as boring as **** to me ...

I'm with Larry. Grey Wagtail, Grey Heron, Gray-cheeked Thrush, Gray Catbird ( and Siberian bloody Tit, FFS ).

Agree with Dan Theman and Chris. And also Gray Squirrel, including when they're invading the UK

I guess I'd like to know if I should be resisting what I see as inappropriate change (shades of Fan-tailed Warbler and Crested Coot), or if I'm out on my own on this one ...

The one I reckon we all should resist is the demand for renaming [European] Black Vulture as "cinereous" so that the US wouldn't have to add 'American' to their Black Vulture. It is completely inaccurate: "cinereous", ash-coloured, means pale whitish-grey, not black.

 

[Mysticete]

The irony...

oh the obnoxious pedantry...

 

[Richard Klim]

The one I reckon we all should resist is the demand for renaming [European] Black Vulture as "cinereous" so that the US wouldn't have to add 'American' to their Black Vulture. It is completely inaccurate: "cinereous", ash-coloured, means pale whitish-grey, not black.

...more correctly, Eurasian Black Vulture – most of the breeding range/population is in Asia (and the type locality is Arabia). The alternative Monk Vulture (reflecting the scientific name) is used by (eg) King 1997 and Ferguson-Lees & Christie 2001, but hasn't gained much traction. Given that it's actually dark brown, how about Blackish Vulture...?

 

[chris butterworth]

We could always go back to the OE "graeg", as its got both 'e' and 'a' in it. Or we could follow Morgan and say "Does it really matter?" ( Siberian Tit being one of the exceptions, of course ). :t:

 

[Larry Sweetland]

The one I reckon we all should resist is the demand for renaming [European] Black Vulture as "cinereous" so that the US wouldn't have to add 'American' to their Black Vulture. It is completely inaccurate: "cinereous", ash-coloured, means pale whitish-grey, not black.

I get round this by calling both of them 'Black Vulture' on my list, just as I call both Rock Wrens 'Rock Wrens', and both Tree Sparrows 'Tree Sparrows'. Works for me, especially as they're all in different families to their namesakes!

I must admit that Zitting Cisticola has firmly stuck with me now, and I love it (sorry Dan). And.....er...... I'm increasingly warming to Loon as a much more fun name. Can't be doing with this Jaeger or Murre nonsense though . Each to there own I guess, I'm just glad my list is in a form where I can call things what I like!

 

[Jos Stratford]

A nice shade of grey on that Gray-cheeked Thrush? Or shade of gray on the Grey Wagtail? Nonsense

Seems fairly simple to me ...whoever the author is should simply spell in the language they use, or perhaps if to be published in a journal then the language of the country where the journal is published. You would not expect an American to alter their spelling of non-bird words on this forum or elsewhere, or vice versa from a British observer ..so why the different expectation for bird names - it is not using a different name, it is merely reflecting a difference in our spelling.

So, it's a nice shade of grey on that Grey-cheeked Thrush for me, and no worries what other people wish to do.

 

[Richard Klim]

I get round this by spelling all 'new world' spp with gray and colored, and all 'old world' spp with grey and coloured on my world list (which is all typed by hand and ammended as it changes). So my list contains eg Gray-cheeked and Grey-backed Thrushes.

Incidentally, although H&M3 (2003) used British spellings, H&M4 (2013/2014) is the only mainstream world checklist to have adopted the Old World/New World approach to the spelling of English common names. So, it uses Gray-cheeked Thrush and Grey-backed Thrush, as per Larry's example.

 

[TwoDipsfromAmsterdam]

When I'm not birding I spend time researching my family history. Going back to the 1841 census (and 1851) it was commonplace for occupations to be written as "laborer". Gradually as the 19th century rolled on it became "labourer". So, as Jane suggests, it's us English who have changed - the North Americans have simply retained the original.

I do recall an academic piece some years ago that suggested that in Jane Austen's time (and before) English was spoken (in England) with what we would now refer to as an American accent. Somehow, "Pride and Prejudice" wouldn't be quite the same with a few "yee-ha"s and "whassup"s thrown in.

David

 

[njlarsen]

Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit. Wisdom is knowing not to put it in a fruit salad.

Good one :t:

Niels

 

[chris butterworth]

I do recall an academic piece some years ago that suggested that in Jane Austen's time (and before) English was spoken (in England) with what we would now refer to as an American accent. Somehow, "Pride and Prejudice" wouldn't be quite the same with a few "yee-ha"s and "whassup"s thrown in.

David

Hmmm. I can see Scouse, Brummie, Geordie or Cockney accents being relatively recent but that would seem to suggest that distinctive regional country accents such as used in rural Yorkshire, Suffolk, Cornwall and elsewhere are relatively 'modern'. Sounds a bit like the "Dick van Dyke School of Language" to me. :-O

 

[Farnboro John]

And also Gray Squirrel, including when they're invading the UK

That's Eastern Gray Squirrel to you, mister!

I'm sure I recall hearing that the reason many traditional European names (Human individuals' names, that is) are spelled with a number of variations is down to variation in the level of education of parish clerks (in America during the years of major immigration, officials registering immigrants) and so on. The reason spellings were not challenged would be the even lower level of education of the average (immigrant/resident) labo(u)rer.

But we are all first world now, although if anyone says "Olde Worlde" then I shall henceforth adopt "Newe Worlde" for the other side of the pond!

And I am quite happy to list Gray-cheeked Thrush in the same list as Grey Plover. Which latter is the only correct English name, so there! o

John

 

[Jane Turner]

Gray predates Grey in English btw

 

[MJB]

Gray predates Grey in English btw

Neat!

However, I'm much more amused by the tendency for predictive text to render the bird's name as 'Grey-checked Thrush'....:eek!:
MJB

 

[Farnboro John]

Neat!

However, I'm much more amused by the tendency for predictive text to render the bird's name as 'Grey-checked Thrush'....:eek!:
MJB

Is predictive text what Alan used to work out one would hit Barra?

John

 

[Paul Clapham]

Incidentally, although H&M3 (2003) used British spellings, H&M4 (2013/2014) is the only mainstream world checklist to have adopted the Old World/New World approach to the spelling of English common names.

The original H&M3 used only British spellings, but the change to Old World/New World English names was done in Corrigenda 4. (I don't know the dates of the corrigenda to H&M3 -- does anybody have that information?)