Hi,
if you can focus on the dust or bubbles (as Scott obviously can), they can't be in the objective lens.
Joachim
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Zeiss Diascope 85 T* FL year of manufacture (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Joker9937
- Start date
Hi,
if you can focus on the dust or bubbles (as Scott obviously can), they can't be in the objective lens.
Joachim
Ian Byrnes
Well-known member
Hi Joachim.....
Where will they be then. On mine at x20 focusing the eyepiece to its extreme at 20 - they appear as slight bubbles and black marks not flecks. I've had specs/flecks in binoculars and these are definitely within glass somewhere. At 20 I can look sidewise and they appear more apparent....zoom out fractionally and they disappear.
There are reports on the Forum of other occurrences so I'm confused.
Your thoughts please...
Regards
Ian
Where will they be then. On mine at x20 focusing the eyepiece to its extreme at 20 - they appear as slight bubbles and black marks not flecks. I've had specs/flecks in binoculars and these are definitely within glass somewhere. At 20 I can look sidewise and they appear more apparent....zoom out fractionally and they disappear.
There are reports on the Forum of other occurrences so I'm confused.
Your thoughts please...
Regards
Ian
henry link
Well-known member
I have one of these old Zeiss zooms. Even when the eyepiece is not on a scope I can easily see all sorts of detritus: specks, flecks, fibers and bubbles or droplets at the 20x setting. That's because at that setting one of the moving internal lenses moves close to the eyepiece field stop, or since the field stop itself also comes into sharpest focus at 20x, it's more likely that both the lens and the field stop move together up close to the internal focal plane of the eyepiece at the 20x setting. What you see might be bubbles in the glass, but I think they're more likely to be tiny droplets of lubricant on the lens surface. Reaching the lens to clean it means disassembling the eyepiece.
If you can't tolerate it I'd return the eyepiece to Zeiss for cleaning or you can do what I've been doing, which is to ignore it and/or increase the magnification until the dirty lens moves far enough away from the focal plane to defocus the stuff and make it invisible.
Henry
Ian Byrnes
Well-known member
Henry good advice..... I'll ignore/increase the magnification and have been doing that already.
This is a 5 year old 20-75 zoom..... Is that an old one in your opinion? Does the new Harpia suffer the same? So the marks are not on the objective?
AND yes Zeiss will no doubt rectify this for me/us if we require under warranty, so I have comfort in that but I'm actually not put off by it and am very impressed with the optics. The image is superb from "22" to 75 magnification and at 75 is second to none ( I imagine) and I think one of the most powerful available. I have another 2 scopes with fixed and zoom options which don't compare to the Diascope but I haven't tried a Harpia, Swarovski or Kowa to compare.
Regards
Ian
Regards
Ian
This is a 5 year old 20-75 zoom..... Is that an old one in your opinion? Does the new Harpia suffer the same? So the marks are not on the objective?
AND yes Zeiss will no doubt rectify this for me/us if we require under warranty, so I have comfort in that but I'm actually not put off by it and am very impressed with the optics. The image is superb from "22" to 75 magnification and at 75 is second to none ( I imagine) and I think one of the most powerful available. I have another 2 scopes with fixed and zoom options which don't compare to the Diascope but I haven't tried a Harpia, Swarovski or Kowa to compare.
Regards
Ian
Regards
Ian
Hi Ian,
any dirt, bubbles, whatever far from the focal plane will not visible and just generate a tiny bit of light loss and/or stray light. For visual impairment of the image you need an astonishing amount of grime on an objective lens or mirror.
For something to be in focus it either needs to be close to the object you are observing or in the image plane of the objective lens/mirror. That is often close to the front element of the eyepiece (the lens at the lower end of the eyepiece) as its retaining ring often serves as field stop which you want to have in the focal plane in order to have a sharp edge of the field.
PS: Henry was faster...
Joachim
any dirt, bubbles, whatever far from the focal plane will not visible and just generate a tiny bit of light loss and/or stray light. For visual impairment of the image you need an astonishing amount of grime on an objective lens or mirror.
For something to be in focus it either needs to be close to the object you are observing or in the image plane of the objective lens/mirror. That is often close to the front element of the eyepiece (the lens at the lower end of the eyepiece) as its retaining ring often serves as field stop which you want to have in the focal plane in order to have a sharp edge of the field.
PS: Henry was faster...
Joachim
Last edited:
Ian Byrnes
Well-known member
Joachim....
Thanks for that.
Ian
Thanks for that.
Ian
Joker9937
Well-known member
Actually, I agree with the consensus regarding the eye-piece. Either that, or some element between the objective and the ep. It is not the worst thing in the world, but I might look into it further. Not in a hurry to do so.
Ian, I agree with you regarding the scope. It is actually growing on me. I liked it immediately, but it is burrowing deeper into my heart. LOL.
I took a 6 mile jaunt this morning. I captured a few other photos, but these are my favorite. I know I said I was done posting, but here they are anyway. Sorry. Originals, and the edited versions. I edited by touching the magic wand button to allow the phone's editing wizard to do the work. Probably far better than my attempt would have been.
I definitely am shopping for a tougher head and tripod. I need something that I can touch at high power and not vibrate to beat the band. I could barely find focus because of this. I think the pics would be sharper if I could find focus.
Any suggestions on a fairly economical choice. Joachim, I did try the backpack hanging on the tripod. I do see that it could be a help, but just not quite enough. Maybe I am just clumsy.
60x photos.
Ian, I agree with you regarding the scope. It is actually growing on me. I liked it immediately, but it is burrowing deeper into my heart. LOL.
I took a 6 mile jaunt this morning. I captured a few other photos, but these are my favorite. I know I said I was done posting, but here they are anyway. Sorry. Originals, and the edited versions. I edited by touching the magic wand button to allow the phone's editing wizard to do the work. Probably far better than my attempt would have been.
I definitely am shopping for a tougher head and tripod. I need something that I can touch at high power and not vibrate to beat the band. I could barely find focus because of this. I think the pics would be sharper if I could find focus.
Any suggestions on a fairly economical choice. Joachim, I did try the backpack hanging on the tripod. I do see that it could be a help, but just not quite enough. Maybe I am just clumsy.
60x photos.
Attachments
Hi,
my favorite head for a full size scope is a 500AH.
Long rail to properly balance the scope (and even longer ones available), counterbalance (a mechanism which will keep a scope or camera which was balanced while horizontal from moving on its own when it is set up non-horizontally - without tightening the vertical friction - which you don't want for smooth tilts), very sturdy, does not break the bank and is about the same weight as the 128RC.
My example was bought for cheap and heavily used from the classifieds in here from a pro who had dragged it around the world and came with a good measure of dust from an unknown desert. I have continued to drag it around the world, but not quite so frequently.
About the only negative thing to say is that the plates are not Arca Swiss compatible - but different sizes are easily available from Manfrotto and 3rd party sellers.
For legs, I would look for used big brand carbon legs - preferably rated for at least double of your intended load, with as few leg sections as you can stand (more leg section = smaller diameter and thus much decreased rigidity of the lowest section and locks = less rigidity - 3 sections are a good compromise - 2 sections are not frequent - the few ones out there are often targeted at birders and recommended), and a height which is sufficient for you without extending the center column (or ideally no center column at all).
A wider spread angle is preferable for better rigidity and of course to lessen the danger of tilt.
Twist or flip locks both work well when in good working order - I personally think that with twist locks there is no lever to break and even when they start to fail you can usually give them a bit more twist until you get home...
As for brands, Gitzo is of course very good and also usually quite expensive even used - if you find a fitting example in good order for $200 or $300, grab it. It will be good.
Manfrotto/Bogen are also well known and tend to go not super cheap used.
Velbon Geo series are nice and can often be found fairly cheap - a 535 or 635 set for $200 or less will serve you nicely - I got a predecessor of the N535 for 90€ iirc... can't complain...
Then there is Feisol, Induro, Sirui et al - some models are good, some not so... read your reviews. https://thecentercolumn.com/ has a lot of good reviews with a focus on rigidity testing.
A last word, a scopac or mulepack is warmly recommended as it really helps to carry the tripod, scope and some stuff like a guide, munchies and water comfortably on longer walks and also serves to add weight and dampen vibrations like the backpack trick.
PS: here's an image for the backpack trick https://www.birdforum.net/showpost.php?p=2438886&postcount=12
Joachim
my favorite head for a full size scope is a 500AH.
Long rail to properly balance the scope (and even longer ones available), counterbalance (a mechanism which will keep a scope or camera which was balanced while horizontal from moving on its own when it is set up non-horizontally - without tightening the vertical friction - which you don't want for smooth tilts), very sturdy, does not break the bank and is about the same weight as the 128RC.
My example was bought for cheap and heavily used from the classifieds in here from a pro who had dragged it around the world and came with a good measure of dust from an unknown desert. I have continued to drag it around the world, but not quite so frequently.
About the only negative thing to say is that the plates are not Arca Swiss compatible - but different sizes are easily available from Manfrotto and 3rd party sellers.
For legs, I would look for used big brand carbon legs - preferably rated for at least double of your intended load, with as few leg sections as you can stand (more leg section = smaller diameter and thus much decreased rigidity of the lowest section and locks = less rigidity - 3 sections are a good compromise - 2 sections are not frequent - the few ones out there are often targeted at birders and recommended), and a height which is sufficient for you without extending the center column (or ideally no center column at all).
A wider spread angle is preferable for better rigidity and of course to lessen the danger of tilt.
Twist or flip locks both work well when in good working order - I personally think that with twist locks there is no lever to break and even when they start to fail you can usually give them a bit more twist until you get home...
As for brands, Gitzo is of course very good and also usually quite expensive even used - if you find a fitting example in good order for $200 or $300, grab it. It will be good.
Manfrotto/Bogen are also well known and tend to go not super cheap used.
Velbon Geo series are nice and can often be found fairly cheap - a 535 or 635 set for $200 or less will serve you nicely - I got a predecessor of the N535 for 90€ iirc... can't complain...
Then there is Feisol, Induro, Sirui et al - some models are good, some not so... read your reviews. https://thecentercolumn.com/ has a lot of good reviews with a focus on rigidity testing.
A last word, a scopac or mulepack is warmly recommended as it really helps to carry the tripod, scope and some stuff like a guide, munchies and water comfortably on longer walks and also serves to add weight and dampen vibrations like the backpack trick.
PS: here's an image for the backpack trick https://www.birdforum.net/showpost.php?p=2438886&postcount=12
Joachim
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henry link
Well-known member
Joker,
I notice that the center column is a little extended in your photo. That should be avoided if possible.
Henry
I notice that the center column is a little extended in your photo. That should be avoided if possible.
Henry
Ian Byrnes
Well-known member
Hey Scott....
That's just greedy....2 Bald Eagles looking dressed to kill !
Looks like Joachim and Henry know there stuff ..... But here's mine - Weifeng tripod and Weifeng fluid head, not cheap but not expensive either (they came with the scope
) and to add to the display my Zeiss 10x42 Conquest HD & Lowepro Flipside 300 which carries the tripod and scope just fine along with coffee, sandwiches and other bits and bobs.
Wrong way up but never mind.......I'll master these attachments one day !
That's just greedy....2 Bald Eagles looking dressed to kill !
Looks like Joachim and Henry know there stuff ..... But here's mine - Weifeng tripod and Weifeng fluid head, not cheap but not expensive either (they came with the scope
) and to add to the display my Zeiss 10x42 Conquest HD & Lowepro Flipside 300 which carries the tripod and scope just fine along with coffee, sandwiches and other bits and bobs.Wrong way up but never mind.......I'll master these attachments one day !
Joker9937
Well-known member
Thank you for those details. Outstanding info. Thank you!
I actually had a Scopac in my "cart" yesterday. I found another option at the last minute. It is from Kite Optics. It looked a little beefier, and was almost the same price. But, I bought neither, because I think I need to put my money towards a tripod and mount. Thinking that I MIGHT find a combo deal somewhere, I thought I would hold off.
I used a back pack I have had for awhile today. It did not work too well, but I made it ok.
Thanks, again.
Joker9937
Well-known member
Thank you, Henry. It took me a few tries, but I came to that conclusion eventually. Thank you.
Joker9937
Well-known member
Hey Scott....
That's just greedy....2 Bald Eagles looking dressed to kill !
Looks like Joachim and Henry know there stuff ..... But here's mine - Weifeng tripod and Weifeng fluid head, not cheap but not expensive either (they came with the scope
Wrong way up but never mind.......I'll master these attachments one day !
View attachment 721412
I really like that tripod. I have not heard of that brand, but I am new.
I love the binos. I carried a classic Leitz (Portugal) 7x42 Trinovid with me today. I ALMOST bought a Conquest a few weeks ago. I have an 8x30 Dialyt roof that I like to carry too.
I clicked on your photo and it was right side up when enlarged.
Ian Byrnes
Well-known member
Hi Scott......
So you've abandoned me, Jo & Henry and broadened your horizons searching for the holy grail of digiscoping ....lol.
It was obviously my upside down blurry pics that did it.
Put my face mask and gloves on today to try and catch a shot of a Red Crested Pochard at a local nature reserve. Made the mistake of taking my dog.... !
Have you ever tried digiscoping while having your dog tugging at you.... It was a disaster but I did get some good shots of the empty sky, muddy grass and out of focus trees. Got excited when I eventually saw it and my battery expired on my phone :C
Joker9937
Well-known member
LOL. No, not abandoning at all. In my mind I was posting too many pics, and going overboard. So, I thought I should post in the designated thread, or something. LOL.
As far as I am concerned, keeping on here is fine. Just did not want overdo it here.
I am not sure what a Red Crested Pochard is, so that is a bummer that you were unable to grab a shot. Yes, combining a dog walk with photography wouldn't work for me. Our little Kerry Blue is an excellent dog in many ways, but...hyper. She'd be a basket-case in that environment. lol
I hope you can grab a shot of the Pochard. I am going to try and get better shots of the turkeys this weekend. The weather is predicted to be much better. We will see.
On a different note, back onto the tripod topic, a friend of mine is an avid long distance shooter and hunter. He mentioned Field Optics Research, as a possible source of an inexpensive tripod. They have a nice group of options. For <$350, it looks like they have a carbon fiber tripod with a capacity of 75#. Seems like an excellent deal(?)
As far as I am concerned, keeping on here is fine. Just did not want overdo it here.
I am not sure what a Red Crested Pochard is, so that is a bummer that you were unable to grab a shot. Yes, combining a dog walk with photography wouldn't work for me. Our little Kerry Blue is an excellent dog in many ways, but...hyper. She'd be a basket-case in that environment. lol
I hope you can grab a shot of the Pochard. I am going to try and get better shots of the turkeys this weekend. The weather is predicted to be much better. We will see.
On a different note, back onto the tripod topic, a friend of mine is an avid long distance shooter and hunter. He mentioned Field Optics Research, as a possible source of an inexpensive tripod. They have a nice group of options. For <$350, it looks like they have a carbon fiber tripod with a capacity of 75#. Seems like an excellent deal(?)
Joker9937
Well-known member
I do really like the scope. You were right.
Out of curiosity, did you use the Baader with an astro adapter? I did not see any with the bayonet attachment (I think that is what it is called). Thanks.
Ian Byrnes
Well-known member
I was only joking about abandoning.....I've seen your other threads elsewhere so I thought I'd pull your leg.
I've used Field Optics from the States for eyepiece shades ( the rubber things that shield the Suns Ray's) which are good by the way. Use them with my Vanguard Endeavor Hoyas 8x42. I haven't looked at their tripods. My tripod new would be about £150 and the head about £80. I've also got a Velbon Sherpa which is ok. Mine are relatively inexpensive to the Gitzo & Sirui carbon fibre, which are much lighter to transport - mine can be very heavy at times and our scopes are heavy to. I've got an Opticron GA 665 GS ED with Opticron smart phone adaptor which I haven't used much yet because I prefer the Diacsope and PhoneSkope, but the Opticron with the Velbon are far more transportable and with fixed 25 & 35 lenses are very commendable. But the Diascope is such a mart bit of kit.
I did see the RC Pochard but my phone battery had died when I was able to get a good shot.....oh well another tick on my bird list.
I haven't got a Baader Astro adaptor as I'm not really in to that. I think it was Henry or Joachim commented on getting the air temperatures aligned before you could get decent results. It's been very rainy, overcast and cloudy any way so not many opportunities to look upwards.
Luckily I'm surrounded by the most idylic country side so can walk for miles without seeing anyone. I've just been out with my dog for 2 hours in the rain - not much chance do look at anything but the birds were still calling beautifully. We haven't the diversity of wildlife as you....what we have tends to be less spectacular although it's great to see deer, badgers etc when they present themselves. I saw a Mink this morning in the distance. Occasionally see Otters........ Beavers are being re-introduced to encourage & create natural flood barriers, something we are suffering badly with of late.
I've used Field Optics from the States for eyepiece shades ( the rubber things that shield the Suns Ray's) which are good by the way. Use them with my Vanguard Endeavor Hoyas 8x42. I haven't looked at their tripods. My tripod new would be about £150 and the head about £80. I've also got a Velbon Sherpa which is ok. Mine are relatively inexpensive to the Gitzo & Sirui carbon fibre, which are much lighter to transport - mine can be very heavy at times and our scopes are heavy to. I've got an Opticron GA 665 GS ED with Opticron smart phone adaptor which I haven't used much yet because I prefer the Diacsope and PhoneSkope, but the Opticron with the Velbon are far more transportable and with fixed 25 & 35 lenses are very commendable. But the Diascope is such a mart bit of kit.
I did see the RC Pochard but my phone battery had died when I was able to get a good shot.....oh well another tick on my bird list.
I haven't got a Baader Astro adaptor as I'm not really in to that. I think it was Henry or Joachim commented on getting the air temperatures aligned before you could get decent results. It's been very rainy, overcast and cloudy any way so not many opportunities to look upwards.
Luckily I'm surrounded by the most idylic country side so can walk for miles without seeing anyone. I've just been out with my dog for 2 hours in the rain - not much chance do look at anything but the birds were still calling beautifully. We haven't the diversity of wildlife as you....what we have tends to be less spectacular although it's great to see deer, badgers etc when they present themselves. I saw a Mink this morning in the distance. Occasionally see Otters........ Beavers are being re-introduced to encourage & create natural flood barriers, something we are suffering badly with of late.
Hi,
you can attach the Baader Hyperion Zoom Mk IV to the Diascope either through the normal Diascope astro adapter or with a special adapter ring only for the Hyperion zoom:
https://www.baader-planetarium.com/en/adapter-mark-iv-zoom-zeiss-m45x05.html?___from_store=de
The latter offers more backfocus and might help to get to infinity when a user with myopia uses the scope without wearing his/her glasses.
Joachim
Joker9937
Well-known member
Ian, I figured you were joshing. LoL. But, better safe than sorry.
I have been perusing the Field Optics Research website. It looks like I could get a carbon tripod with 35# capacity for around $200. I would have to shop for a heavier-duty head, probably something like you suggested, Joachim, but that tripod price seems pretty good. I am going to check out my buddy's tripod, just to see whether the quality strikes me.
I have been shopping for a used heavy-duty tripod, but everything is $300 and up, or junk. But, still might stroll across a good deal.
I added 10# of weights to my backpack, and strapped that to my current tripod. That actually DID help. However, I do not think that I want to add that much extra weight to my backpack. Really, the concern is not the weight, but having my scope inside the pack with two loose weights rolling around inside. I might try it this weekend, though. No huge rush, but the vibration is very significant.
I like people, sometimes, Ian, but envy the idea of walking for miles and seeing no one. That would be nice. Looking forward to more of your bird photos.
With the backpack/weights I was able focus on this lightbulb today. It is raining (has been the last few days) and is very gloomy. But, I think that focusing on this bulb from 50 feet away, and at 60x, is pretty good. Maybe it means nothing, but before the backpack, I could not get this fine of a focus.
Joachim, I ordered the astro adapter that you linked me to on the first day, this morning. I hope it works. I have looked around for used adapters and/or used newer eps (that supposedly improves the images even further, correct?), but those are not very common, it appears.
Even the unedited version looks pretty good to me, but I like the edited version.
Ian, I envy the idea of walking for miles and seeing no one. I look forward to seeing more of your bird photos.
I have been perusing the Field Optics Research website. It looks like I could get a carbon tripod with 35# capacity for around $200. I would have to shop for a heavier-duty head, probably something like you suggested, Joachim, but that tripod price seems pretty good. I am going to check out my buddy's tripod, just to see whether the quality strikes me.
I have been shopping for a used heavy-duty tripod, but everything is $300 and up, or junk. But, still might stroll across a good deal.
I added 10# of weights to my backpack, and strapped that to my current tripod. That actually DID help. However, I do not think that I want to add that much extra weight to my backpack. Really, the concern is not the weight, but having my scope inside the pack with two loose weights rolling around inside. I might try it this weekend, though. No huge rush, but the vibration is very significant.
I like people, sometimes, Ian, but envy the idea of walking for miles and seeing no one. That would be nice. Looking forward to more of your bird photos.
With the backpack/weights I was able focus on this lightbulb today. It is raining (has been the last few days) and is very gloomy. But, I think that focusing on this bulb from 50 feet away, and at 60x, is pretty good. Maybe it means nothing, but before the backpack, I could not get this fine of a focus.
Joachim, I ordered the astro adapter that you linked me to on the first day, this morning. I hope it works. I have looked around for used adapters and/or used newer eps (that supposedly improves the images even further, correct?), but those are not very common, it appears.
Even the unedited version looks pretty good to me, but I like the edited version.
Ian, I envy the idea of walking for miles and seeing no one. I look forward to seeing more of your bird photos.
Attachments
Last edited:
Hi,
nice that the backpack trick now works for you... maybe use not iron weights but plastic water bottles - less likely to ruin the scope, keep you hydrated and you can empty them when you're done digiscoping...
As for field optics - they're probably not a favorite here due to their strong focus on hunting and shooting.
But regardless, the only carbon tripod I see on their page for 200 USD is 50 inches high with the column extended and 38 inches with the column down. Unless you also carry a stool, I don't see how that is going to work.
Regarding the other models, I'm a bit wary about the low weights and super high loads given (although it has to be said that they're in good company there - yes, I'm looking at you, Gitzo).
The medium model (out of stock) has 4 leg segments - I would probably look at the top model with 3 leg segments, if at all.
But if you can visit a friend and test one, by all means do. Take your current kit for comparison and then put the 128RC and scope on that tripod and compare. And please share the results!
Joachim
nice that the backpack trick now works for you... maybe use not iron weights but plastic water bottles - less likely to ruin the scope, keep you hydrated and you can empty them when you're done digiscoping...
As for field optics - they're probably not a favorite here due to their strong focus on hunting and shooting.
But regardless, the only carbon tripod I see on their page for 200 USD is 50 inches high with the column extended and 38 inches with the column down. Unless you also carry a stool, I don't see how that is going to work.
Regarding the other models, I'm a bit wary about the low weights and super high loads given (although it has to be said that they're in good company there - yes, I'm looking at you, Gitzo).
The medium model (out of stock) has 4 leg segments - I would probably look at the top model with 3 leg segments, if at all.
But if you can visit a friend and test one, by all means do. Take your current kit for comparison and then put the 128RC and scope on that tripod and compare. And please share the results!
Joachim
