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Swallow Subspecies in Africa (1 Viewer)

Oregonian

Well-known member
I'm confused by Barn Swallows we saw in Uganda last November. Field guides show white-bellied birds, but there were a lot with orange bellies, like the American subspecies. The one attached here is from Queen Elizabeth II National Park on November 26, 2022, Is this just a young European white-bellied bird? The breast band seems solid for that. Or does the Egyptian race migrate south?
 

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Hello Jeff,

I havent seen the Egyptian race before, and like you hope for comments.

I just want to say, that birds with peachy, orange (-cream) or reddish underparts are rare, but regular in breeding birds in Germany (ssp. rustica). But I have only seen single individuals between "normal" looking Barn Swallows yet (a few annual). Not "a lot" like you.

Here is one: all Rauchschwalbe 24.5.18 (24.052018, Prenzlau, NE-Germany)
 
I was also hoping that someone knowledgeable would post on this topic.

Where I am in Nara Japan, we have zillions of Barn Swallows breeding in the spring and roosting later (we also have Red-rumped, but they breed outside the city).

Because these birds are so common and all the same, I and most of the birders I know don't photograph them often.

But a pair has bred for a few years outside my window (maybe three metres from where I'm typing this) and I attach a photo of one of these birds - Photo 1 - these should be the ssp gutturalis, the Asian ssp. with a white underside.

And in 2017 when I was taking my regular walk, I saw a few birds that seemed different (all together in the same spot, perched on the same line). And there seemed to be three types: Pale, reddish underneath, and red underneath. I attach some photos of these. A mystery for me - they should be connected given that they were in the exact same spot on the same day, but maybe they were three types that flocked together on migration, and so ended up in this way?

On the basis of Mark Brazil's book, 'Birds of East Asia' I put the most red underneath bird down as the ssp saturata (I don't think they are right for the illustrated spp tytleri).

I put the bird with light red underneath as ssp rustica, but I don't remember why (or indeed where I found this ssp).

And the really pale bird in moult I didn't know what to do with.

If anyone has any comments, that would be great.

1 Regular Bird
2 Pale Bird
3. Light Red Underneath BIrd (Rustica)
4 Heavy Red Underneath (Saturata)
5 Light and Heavy together to show they are not the same

200601008 Home.JPG
170810033 Nara Ponds.JPG
170810028 Nara Ponds.JPG
170810025 Nara Ponds.JPG
170810028X Nara Ponds.jpg
 
Hello MacNara,

I agree with Butty:
your posts are excellent, full of informations, thoughts and your explaining pictures (may they be improved/enhanced versions of the originals or illustrations of your text) are very helpful to me.

And the date could well add here.

Most important: thanks so much for sharing them and please kkep them comin. Thanks!
 
Could you give the dates, please? Thanks.
2. If the date is appropriate, it's a juvenile.

Apologies about the dates - Butty is right, I should have been explicit.

If you hover over the photo with your cursor, then the file name includes the dates. It's so automatic with me that I forget others will not realise - every photo I file at home has a unique number ID - YYMMDDxxx and also a location word (occasionally a not-location word). (Sometimes I post edited photos on BF for illustration purposes which do not follow this rule, especially when replying to others' queries). Basically, since digital photography started, all of the thousands of photos I have taken can be put in time order simply by ordering them by filename; and they also have a bunch of keywords attached to the file as well as being in one or more of my iView Media Pro catalogues.

The first photo above (Post #3) is 200601 - i.e 1st June 2020
All the others are 170810 - i.e. 10th August 2017 (and all taken within a few minutes of each other)

'Nara Ponds' is my local spot. 'Home' in this case means I could have taken that photo from the desk where I am typing this.

Barn Swallows in Japan usually make nests on overhangs on houses and other buildings. Instead of knocking them down because of the mess, people, shops, and even large department stores put cardboard boxes below the nests to catch the 'overflow' and people think it normal to walk around these for two or three months of the year. It's one of the neat things about this country (I'm not saying all things are 'neat' but some are).

When I first came to Japan, I was surprised. But I was told that many people regard it as lucky if a Swallow family chooses them. And as to why the Swallows breed a few tens of centimetres from people was explained to me as that the Swallows have realised that people are no threat, and indeed that their nests are more likely to be safe from snakes and other problems if they are near humans. Having said that, the birds I can see from my window (who seem to do two broods a year) have lost at least two broods to Crows over the last three years.

A thing that was strange about the day of my above photos (post #3) - 10th August 2017 - is that there seemed to be just one or two individuals of each type that I have posted - i.e I haven't selected a few odd birds from a huge group - which makes me think more that there was something special about this group being in this spot on that day (e.g. a special migration). I've never seen this collection before or since.

The bird that Butty thinks will be a juvenile was by itself - i.e. there were no (other) local Barn Swallows, which in my experience would be strange for a juvenile at that season. If you look at the back of the bird, it has dropped a lot of back feathers - rather than a juvenile, I wondered if it might be sick. But apart from the back, it looked OK, so...

In addition to the birds I posted above, there were a couple of Red-rumped Swallows (posted below) on those wires - again this is strange, because the Red-rumped which breed in our area (the closest spot I know is about 20km away) come through at a different time, and there are often a lot of them on the way in in May and the way out in mid- to late- September.

So Mid- August for all of these birds is a bit odd.

And Alex's comment on this thread prompted me to post.

I'm not even sure that saturata and rustica are real things. So, comments and criticism welcome.

And best wishes for the New Year to both Butty and Alex. I hope the three of us will continue the productive interaction we have had on BIrd Forum over the last few years.

MacNara

170810022 Nara Ponds.JPG
 
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August = fine for juvenile.
'rustica' = nominate race of Hirundo rustica.
Thanks Butty:

But what do think about the serious moulting on the back of the ('juvenile') bird? Also it 'just doesn't look right' for our local Barn Swallows.

And as regards rustica, our local ssp is gutturalis, i.e the bird with a very white breast as in my first photo, and even if the 'pale' bird is juvenile of this ssp, having two other non-local ssp (rustica and saturata) on the same wire at the same instant is interesting, isn't it?

And I think this is relevant to the original post by Oregonian where s/he was commenting on the unexpected apparent variety of ssp that s/he saw, simply as a matter of discussing these apparent (but maybe not to those who know) anomalies.

Just for additional fun, in 2019 we saw a Barn Swallow on the 3rd January at my local spot. Completely mysterious - earliest arrival late February or early March. Gone by mid-October (normally). Photos attached.

Trailer: MacNara Sparrowhawk variety thread coming up in the next week.

190103010 Nara Ponds.JPG190103015 Nara Ponds.JPG
 
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I haven't checked anything, but I'd guess post-juvenile moult in August is unremarkable.
Given individual variation (see, eg, Alex's birds), it may be unwise to assign race to birds other than known local breeders.
 
Regarding the OP's bird, perhaps it is discolored by red soil? Dusty day and drinking from a puddle?

You can see the flanks still look white.
Just a thought.
 
Regarding the OP's bird, perhaps it is discolored by red soil? Dusty day and drinking from a puddle?

You can see the flanks still look white.
Just a thought.
Just to add to the confusion, some swallow species are thought to follow the dragonfly migration to East Africa from India directly across the northern Indian Ocean (when the Inter-Tropical Convergence Zone forms), feeding on them on the wing, but return in an arc over land, crossing the Red Sea at its southern end and the Gulf at the Strait of Hormuz.
MJB
 
Given individual variation (see, eg, Alex's birds), it may be unwise to assign race to birds other than known local breeders.

Of course. But I thought the purpose of this thread from the original post by Oregonian and the reply by Alex was to show some unusual combinations of colouring on Barn Swallows and see if anyone had anything interesting to say about them, and that's what I thought I had done.

Surely it's OK to point out that you have seen a group of birds which go way beyond 'individual variation', and without any special purpose.

To repeat, all of the birds on that wire that I saw that day have been posted, and there aren't hundreds off-screen which look 'perfectly normal'.

So I just wonder, abstractly, why several individuals which look 'not right for this spot' should show up on one day (indeed one minute). Rustica as the ssp is rare
 
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The dragonfly is a Wandering Glider. What an interesting species, migrating over the ocean covering different continents. This species was the „dragonfly of the year 2021“ in Germany
 
Ha! Ha!

Maybe the unusual Swallows I posted earlier were actually following this species of dragonfly which is also common at the right season in exactly this spot.

(By the way, not such a stupid joke: one year we had a Red-breasted flycatcher which stayed for a couple of months because a certain species of day-flying moth was available in vast numbers not seen before or since.)

Two photos attached.

Test for Butty: can you work out when these photos were taken?

080903008 Nara Ponds.jpg150824004 Heijokyo.JPG
 
...and Amur falcons.
I have seen Bull-headed Shrike take various small birds, but yesterday I saw one trying to take a Grey-headed Lapwing (about four times its size, I guess). Nonetheless, I find it difficult to believe that a Swallow would try to take an Amur Falcon - you must be kidding us, Butty!

(Although I attach a photo of a juvenile Goshawk dragging a juvenile Black-crowned Night Heron out of one of our ponds after the Goshawk had swooped from inside the wood and drowned the Heron.)

190202020 Nara Ponds.JPG
 
Hello MacNara and Butty,

I hope you dont regard this as an offence but may I enter too?
The first picture was taken on 08. September and the second on 15. August.

If this is right, what is my prize? My friends surely hope its a decent camera with a long tele-photo lens.

And again thanks for sharing your pictures of a Wandering Slider (? I am very, very far from an expert here)! It has been recorded in central Europe now, amazing for me given its long migration route, driven by wind-systems.

Edit: wer lesen kann ist klar im Vorteil

first: 03. September 2008
second: 24. August 2015
 
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